The Case of the Stunt Shows: Indy versus Water

[00:00:16] Welcome to the Supreme Resort, Land v. World, a podcast about Disneyland and Walt Disney World, and I guess Universal for some reason. And to decide which is the Supreme Resort. Each episode we will discuss and explore each resort ride by ride, land by land, park by park, show by show to determine which is better. I'm your host, Jimmy, and thank you for joining me on this quest to help the greater good of humanity answer this long elusive question, which is better?

[00:00:46] Universal Studios Hollywood? Or what's it called now? Disney MGM Studios. Yeah, there you go. That's what they call it. Joining me as always is Dan. Hi, Dan. Oh, sorry. I didn't realize I was busy watching The Wolfman again. I just, you know how much I love that movie. Yeah. Oh yeah. Oh, sorry. Dan, that's Dan Pepsi Linkletter. That's right. For all the... Patriot. Yeah, thank you.

[00:01:14] Eric also. Hi, Eric. I've been listening to old Wolfman Jack segments. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Okay. So... I am impressed that they didn't do that. I think I missed a step somewhere along the line. Well, we'll get into it. Okay. No, you didn't. You're fine.

[00:01:41] Okay. So today's episode is going to be the Studio Park Stunt Show Spectaculars. Wood v. World. Before we get to that, Eric is going to share with us why we're talking about Universal. Before we get to that, let's talk about Universal. Universal Studios Florida opened a third, and yes, I'm saying it, third gate. Third theme park. Oh, we're eliminating Volcano Bay.

[00:02:11] Is that what we're doing? Well, I mean, it's a water park, right? Yeah, water parks don't count. We don't say that there are... We don't say there are six theme parks at Disney World, do we? No, we do not. We say four theme parks, two water parks, et cetera. I'm just thinking now that this is the sort of chicanery that Universal gets to. That's right. Counting a water park as a park. By all accounts, they did it right. The third time.

[00:02:36] By all accounts that I've heard, Epic Universe will rival any of the four Disney World theme parks. I think that's fair to say... Once it's all open. It's like kind of in Florida, right? Like it's like far away from Universal. It is in Florida. It is... Here's the other advantage. Here's the problem with Universal Studios Florida proper.

[00:03:02] If you want to get to that water park, you got to park in the same parking structure and walk all the way through City Walk and all the way past Universal and past Islands of Adventure. And you have to get to the water park. If you want to go to Epic Universe, it's its own parking lot. But it's like far away though, right? I mean, I... Well, I mean, it's not that far. I'm not trying to... I realize that there's probably a perception that I'm looking to be negative about this.

[00:03:31] And while that is sometimes my... Perceived to be my default setting, that's not where I'm going with this. I just... It really... My understanding is that it is a drive away. It is closer to Universal than Animal Kingdom is to Magic Kingdom. Okay, that's fair. I thought it was further than that. Okay. I made that up. I don't know if that's true. Well, I'll do a fact check while we're talking. Well, so... It probably is true though.

[00:04:01] Yeah, I think it is. But anyway, Epic Universe is a new theme park that's not quite open yet, but it's done previews and I've listened to all the things. I thought it was open. No, it's just like previews and annual pass holders and, you know, guests and... Hotel guests. Influencers and whatnot. Right. I don't know why we weren't too invited. The phase opening, which is really smart in that the phase opening, you can't like May 20th or whenever it opens... May 22nd.

[00:04:30] You can't just show up and buy a ticket. In order to go to the park, you have to buy a four-day three-park pass or four-park pass. I think it's something like that. And, you know, I'm speaking in generalities, but it's basically like if you want to go to Universal Epic Universe, you have to buy a four-day pass to all the parks. And one of those days you can go to Epic Universe. Which... Which only go once. Sounds like is not enough to experience the park.

[00:04:58] So, well... I rephrased the question or statement. That was... I was going to say that was a statement. It sounds like because everything is such an e-ticket there, it's universal. It's a you-ticket. But... Not everything. But so much of it is... And I think e-ticket is industry-wide. It's not specific to Disney. Possibly. Okay. You... Well, he's not done with his thoughts.

[00:05:25] There are long lines for everything and you can't possibly do all of the things in a day. That's right. But what it does, before Dan goes, what it does is it will allow for them to control the amount of people who are going. Because there's only so many people who just really, really want to go to that park that are not already influencers or whatever. And the only way for them to go is to spend $1,000 to get tickets. And so you're going to eliminate a bunch of just, hey, that's interesting. I'll go there. You know what I mean?

[00:05:54] So it's going to be hardcore. You're going to be able to limit the number of people who go to the park for a while until you sort it all out. I'd say probably come this fall, it'll be just come on, buy a ticket and let's go. How many days at club level do I have to stay? That's a good question. Sorry, that's my reputation. It's just a character. I'd never stay at club level. Anyway, Dan. I didn't realize that it was that they were doing like that. I don't know. It looks like there's so.

[00:06:24] So the videos that I'm watching, it's hard. The narrative that I'm bringing to this is that I think a lot of people have rightfully wanted to have there be like an actual challenger to the Disney. Disney throne in Florida. I think that that's fine. And I think that this might be it.

[00:06:45] But I also think that this goes back to universal is almost always graded on a curve compared to Disney where it's like, oh, they did a themed thing. They tried. So it's amazing when it's just like, yeah, it's like, look, they tried instant points for trying. And like, that's fine. But if we're going to look at it from an objective point of view, it's like, did they though?

[00:07:13] I mean, yeah, they put, they poured a lot of money into it. And some of the, some of the, some of the things look genuinely impressive. I like the idea that they have celestial park as like a park atmosphere, but let's face it. We're not far away from there being like beer carts all over that place. And there's a roller coaster running through it. Right. And that, that looks cool. But at the same time, I think that's the problem. That's the general problem with universal. Yeah. Yeah. I don't, I don't take issue necessarily.

[00:07:42] I get what you're saying, but I don't necessarily take issue with that because that could be like, it fits into the theme. Well, ish that they, the theme adjacent theme that they have. I get that. But what I'm getting at Dan, to your point, I'm sort of buttressing your point by saying that universal, like, so Epic universe is closer. They're getting closer. Excuse me. Let me rephrase. Islands of adventure was closer. Okay. They did a better job. Right.

[00:08:12] Right. And then Harry Potter got there. Right. And I would argue as good or better than anything Disney's ever done. The problem is you have that immersive environment like Hogsmeade, right? And you go into the three broomsticks in Florida and there's a roller coaster themed after Jurassic Park that goes by every 60 seconds. Right. You're taken out. So that's the problem with universal. Well, if you're sitting on the patio. Yeah.

[00:08:42] Well, but still even. Yeah. You're doing the thing, but you're not actually doing the thing. You're just doing enough of the thing that people will go, yay, you did it. And honestly, all I'm thinking of when I'm watching this is first of all, that looks like a genuinely interesting place. I don't really know that video is doing it properly. And I want to be fair with that.

[00:09:02] But also it feels like, I feel it has that sort of mall feeling like nice mall, but just like, I don't think that like. All I see is, oh my God, that place looks like just nothing but constant sun and heat. Yeah. Yeah. Stuff has to grow. Yeah. Well, yeah, that's true. It's just, but that's just kind of all I'm seeing. And like, yes, I do want to go.

[00:09:31] I would love to go on the monsters unchained or whatever. But at the same time, it's like, it's kind of just a fuster clock of like, here's all the monster IP in one ride rather than it being like, let's actually make something that is coherent. It looks impressive as hell. Sure does. I'm watching the ride throughs.

[00:09:53] I'm just like, this just looks like just a mash of stuff that like the mash itself might be interesting. Would you go so far as to say it's a monster mash? It's a monster mash. Oh, okay. They did the mash and it was a graveyard smash is what I'm trying to say. Okay. So I'm going to interrupt you again and say that I've said this before. If not for Harry Potter, if Universal does not get that contract, this park doesn't exist.

[00:10:24] Oh, totally. And they did better with Ones of Adventure. They nailed it with Harry Potter Land. And I think they finally did it. I think that this park, because the owner, Universal, excuse me, Comcast is to Universal theme parks as Oriental Land Company is to Tokyo Disney. There's no limit. So you're saying just the open checkbook, go for it. Open checkbook, do it.

[00:10:52] Like, let's take the mouse down. Let us show them how it's done. Texas Park, UK Park. I mean, there's, I think it's OLC is what it is. Yeah. I think my reaction to it is more about the reaction to it than it is for the actual place. Because the actual place looks interesting. And I mean that in all the ways that that can be taken.

[00:11:20] But the reaction to it seems to be really outsized where it's just like, this is better than anything I've ever done. Like, well, yeah, that one specific thing is very cool. It's shiny and new. But it's just like, okay, well, yes, that one thing is very cool and it's very interesting. But this thing right next to it looks like a mall. Right. And they said that about Islands of Adventure too. Yeah, yeah.

[00:11:47] I feel like the reaction is, it seems disingenuous, but it seems also genuine. Because like, I think it does come from that place of, I just want to see someone do this thing at something approaching the same level. But then there's no objective layer coming in and going like, look, I'm really glad that they did this. But this is not actually the same.

[00:12:15] I think also the outsized reaction, Dan, is again, shiny new. The last time a major theme park was built in Florida was in 2001 or 2000 maybe. And guess who built it? Universal. Yeah. So it's big, shiny and new. And if Disney were to open a fifth theme park, it would be the greatest thing of all time because it's just, it's new. It's new technology, all that stuff.

[00:12:43] But if I guess just a couple of finer points, the Ministry of Magic queue evidently is like a ride in and of itself. And that looks great. I love that aspect of it. And I love that they're giving you a space where you can just kind of hang out if you want to. It appears to be that way where it's like, as opposed to Rise of the Resistance, which is like, okay, you're in the biggest, coolest, most awesome room that you're going to see this entire thing. Go, go, go, go, go, go, go. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, that's right.

[00:13:12] Where I think Ministry of Magic saw that and they were like, no, we're going to give you a space that you're not rushed. You can hang out. The ride itself looks fine. Have you seen any video of it? Yeah, I have. I've seen forbidden videos of it. I've also seen Faces of Death several times. And I think. Classic HBO.

[00:13:36] The kooka arm thing is cool, but I think they're in danger of it just being kind of like where they went with like the Transformers sort of screen rides where it's just like, oh, it's just this thing and it has real fire and that's what makes it work. It's the universal thing. Yeah. That they keep doing a mix of animatronics. Don't forget water too. They like to splash water too. Right.

[00:13:59] And they do, they do, they seem to have not been making any effort to get away from that trope of like, oh, look at them. You can help us too. Or like the, the trope of like the Igor thing, which is like, hey, I'm, I'm interesting. What's up guys. To the listener, Dan shoved his face in front of the camera.

[00:14:28] And it's like, I guess where I'm going with this is it looks aesthetically interesting, but like the soul in it is like not entirely there. So the thing that, the things that I don't understand, and I haven't looked into this a ton. Um, I will say the, the original Harry Potter stuff was great.

[00:14:54] I always said, I want, I mean, Brandy and I have spent like most of a day just standing around in Hogsmeade and looking around and going, why can't we go in the cauldron shop? Why isn't the cauldron shop a real thing? It's just set dressing. And then they opened up Diagon Alley and almost everything is a real shop and it's amazing. And it's great. And you can do that. You can spend all day in these places and then you can go and do your, your fun stuff at both parks that you still want to do. The ET adventure.

[00:15:23] I love, I still love doing that. Right. I know. Like it's, it's so great. Steven Spielberg just made $12. By, by me saying that? Just by you saying it. Okay. Wow. Well, good for him. He deserves it. Read the movies. Still best thing about that, right? Is everyone on his planet referring to him as ET. Right. I can't remember his actual name. Despite all these years. Yeah. I know, I know Botanicus. I know Senator Greb leaps from.

[00:15:53] Obviously. From the Phantom Menace. From the Phantom Menace. From the Phantom Menace. Well, anyway, like that stuff's great and we've got this new park and it's in the middle of nowhere and you've got to go there. The thing that I really don't get and I, I, I hate the politics that kind of go behind the whole thing. Whoa, whoa, whoa, Eric. Let's not talk about politics on this podcast. No, no, no. We won't talk about the politics.

[00:16:16] Let's talk about just the effect of the politics, which is this was supposed to be France in what? The twenties because of, uh, one of the, the, uh, fantastic beast, fantastic beasts movies, which I mean, I've seen all of them. And it, it, because think certain things have happened.

[00:16:40] Somehow you're traveling through time and we have to drag, you know, Daniel Radcliffe and all of his pals back in and do a movie that is. Set somehow after, uh, he who shall not be named is gone. I don't know. Um, no, he's after he's gone. Not that guy. Dolores, Dolores Umbridge is like the most famous man in the world.

[00:17:10] Good pole. So yeah, I, I mean, sure. I mean, we, even Disney, you know, there's stretches and theming and whatever. Yeah, but they, they designed this whole land and somehow we're back in the ministry of magic back in, in England. And I, I love the design of it. I haven't looked into it a whole bunch. I want to, I want to see it for myself. I don't like spoiling a lot, but I've seen some of it and like, okay. Yeah. That's exactly what it is in the movies.

[00:17:36] It, it looks incredible, but we are, we are stretching things a bit because we're, we're changing timelines and we're trying to like scramble and go, ah, ah, nobody liked these movies. Ah, yeah, that's true. Um, and also they couldn't build a ministry of magic in Epic universe because it's, I don't know, whatever. Anyway, um, whatever. But yeah. So back to your point about a Diagon Alley and going and there's, there's a shop.

[00:18:02] I was there in January and there's just a storefront, unassuming storefront. You walk in there and all it is, is a money exchange where you can exchange muggle money for, for wizarding money. Yeah. You can buy it in the park and there's a goblin just hanging out. Right. But moving, and there's also a person there who doesn't want you to be in there. That's true. In my experience. That's true. What are you doing here?

[00:18:30] But there's a, there's a full on goblin animatronic just chilling out. Right. It's just like, it's so cool. It's stuff that, uh, anyway, they, like I said, I've said it before, say it again, better than anything Disney's ever done. I, I think with the, what I'm saying with Epic universe is like, I like the scale of it. I like the ambition of it. I really, I, I like that they, that someone is doing that, that someone is holding Disney's feet to the fire and going like, no, you need to mean it. Yeah. But yeah. It's the late night wars all over. But they aren't showing.

[00:19:00] Properties too. Right. But they also aren't showing me that they mean it other than just to do that. And I, I think there's like where I got there is that when Jimmy, you were talking about the Diagon Alley and I, I, when I've heard people talk about that, I always hear them talk about it with the sense of like wonder and discovery and like, oh my God, they actually did this thing. And it's so amazing.

[00:19:27] And this thing being this, that they made this sense of wonder and discovery. And with Epic universe, I feel like the, oh my God, I can't believe they made this thing is just simply the park itself. And while that is impressive, I don't see it being like all, a lot of the videos that I'm saying and a lot of the reactions are sort of like, it's almost like someone going through it and saying like, oh wow. I really feel like I should be feeling a sense of wonder and discovery here.

[00:19:56] So I must be feeling that. And then like some character actor will come up to you and just be like, hello, don't you feel like you're having a sense of wonder and discovery? Let me show you the sense of wonder and discovery over here. Its name is trash can. And it's just like, yeah. Do you think that any of this has something to do with all the, most of the people that are going there are annual pass holders or influencers. Who are going there for free.

[00:20:26] Universal actually lets influencers come there. Like not the mega influencers. Right. Disney only lets the people that they pay come these days because Disney always looks at things and go and says, oh, influencers. Okay. Oh, you do a blog. Oh, we don't do blogs anymore. No, no. You need to do it. A tick tock. And you need to be the biggest tick tock. You need to be Disney food blog. And I don't know.

[00:20:53] Mr. Beast tomorrow gets to go. By the way. I think that that is definitely part of it. And I think that that also adds to some of the uncanny valley, like feeling that I'm getting where it's just like, okay, I get that. That is legitimately cool. What you're showing me is actually cool. And it looks interesting, but it's not like, oh, my God, I'm going to explode in tears.

[00:21:21] Well, if your thing is how to train your dragon, then yeah, you will. If your thing is Harry Potter, you know. Look, I'm not making fun of Chris Provost's wife. Okay. If that's. Should I reach out to Knott's again? That seems like a good level for us to start at. We got turned out once. No, no, no. We just landed on it. Uh-oh. We go to Knott's and we treat it the same way these people are treating Epic Universe. Oh. That guy was a guest of the show, isn't it?

[00:21:52] The guy who does that was a guest of the show. Yeah. Yeah. Well, no, he's not insane. He's just. Quirky. So just to bring it full circle. Yeah. Epic Universe is 3.9 miles away from Universal Studios. It's not that far. Epcot is five miles from Animal Kingdom. Yeah, it sure is. From the United Kingdom. Yeah. And to be fair. I've run that distance. There is a certain amount of team sports aspect here.

[00:22:22] Yeah, of course. Where a lot of the Disney people are going, oh, it's so far away. And then like, well, it's not really that far. And I get that. I really don't want it to come off as me being like, I don't like it because it's universal, universal bad, anything like that. My main bone of contention. It goes back to the Dan Hates the Beatles thing where it's just like, I don't actually have. Wait, you hate the Beatles? No, it's a character I played once. Okay.

[00:22:51] And the motivation of the character was that while I love the Beatles very much and agree that they are the most important band ever, the character's contention was that it's not so much that I have a problem with the thing. It's that the reaction seems. Outsized. Outsized and performative. There we go. That's fair. All right, well, let's move on to.

[00:23:20] Your attention, please. Another Universal Studios topic. Eric, why are we talking about Waterworld stunt spectacular? Because I wanted to talk about the Indiana Jones stunt spectacular. And the only. No one. Disney doesn't do a lot of stunt spectaculars anymore. They've they had the car, the lights, camera. That's right. Lights, motors, action. Lights, motors, action at the same park. They don't do that anymore. And nobody has done anything like that on the West Coast. So.

[00:23:50] I mean, we could just do the pirate ship scene from Fantastic. Yeah. Okay. Okay. I mean, we could also do the scene in Las Vegas where the pirate ship blew up in the hotel. Sinks. Treasure Island, by the way. And they filled it with sexy ladies or enough people were watching. There we go. But really, I mean, Universal has stunt spectaculars. That's a little more what they're known for.

[00:24:17] And I thought about the Bourne stunt spectacular at Universal Orlando. But last time when I tried to go there, it was down. So I didn't get to see it. And then I thought, you know what? You know who has seen a stunt spectacular? It's people who have been to West Coast parks. I've never even been to Universal. Orlando is what I was about to say. Hollywood. Did you say Orlando? That was literally what was about to come out of my mouth.

[00:24:46] Eric, we've ruined you. I'm sorry. I don't mean to say anything. The words horror and come out of my mouth. Yeah. No, no. I wouldn't say anything so vulgar. Come on. Excuse me. Come on. By the way, judging by the look of my video, this episode might end up being sponsored by Spectrum Cable. Oh, all right. But yeah, you know, we broke outside of the parks on our last major episode. Benny Hanna. Benny Hanna.

[00:25:15] Like that was something we've been talking about for a while. Like how do we do some of these things? That's a good point. Because there's so much in Walt Disney World. How do we compare it to the West Coast? Why did another podcast not cover Indiana Jones done spectacular? Which. Oh, that's an excellent question. You mean. That's something. You mean a podcast that I'm also on? Hmm. No. Well, no, not you. But like the Dollywood reporter, for example, why wouldn't they cover Indiana Jones? Oh, well, Dollywood.

[00:25:45] Or the Six Flags boys. The Six Flags boys. They might have gotten to it eventually. I think a few more of them died recently. That's right. I've been listening to the show. That's right. There's only one left right now. Oh, and so you're talking about the podcast Harrison Comparison. Oh, no. What is that? It's where they compare different properties involving Harrison Ford. Harrison Ford. Oh, my God. That's brilliant. What a great name.

[00:26:16] The Harrison Comparison. You know what? It's a roundtable podcast. As a matter of fact, we're going to... Should we just do the Harrison Comparison? That's right. I don't have to ask Jared to make more music. Thank you for listening to our hot takes on Epic Universe. Be good to each other. Constance ears. 8-5-6. Our ears. Until next time.

[00:26:46] Is this how we track our listeners into listening to a lot of these episodes? Oh, my goodness. Welcome to the Harrison Comparison. Podcast about Harrison Ford and his multiple properties. Last week's episode was... Regarding Henry. Regarding Henry. And don't forget, listeners...

[00:27:16] Don't forget, listeners... Harrison Ford is not Clint Eastwood. I hope you enjoyed last week's episode regarding Henry. It was written by... The guy who did Lost in episode 7. Don't forget, everyone. My chart showing the math of Clint Eastwood plus Jack Nicholson equals... Harrison Ford. That was really smart. That was a really smart take.

[00:27:46] I really enjoyed your Photoshop of putting Harrison Ford's face on Jack Nicholson holding up that cigarette while he's swimming. I'm just saying, regarding Henry was a really good movie. And it was written by the... What's his name? Why can't I think of his name? Damon Lindelof? The News Spielberg. Episode 7 director. Episode 9 director. Wrote Lost. Ryan Johnson. Oh. Blah, blah.

[00:28:17] Thank you, listener, for screaming. It's not getting us there. Kevin Spacey. No. Abrams. J.J. Abrams. J.J. Abrams. Show regarding Henry. It's a delightful film. Jefferson Abrams. Jefferson Abrams. No, Jefferson Abrams wrote Witness. An underrated Harrison Ford movie. Anyway, thank you for joining us for the Harrison Comparison. Harrison Comparison. Brought to you by... Ooh.

[00:28:46] That's our theme song. Our first round. Harrison Ford. Better Hulk than Mark Ruffalo. Go. Wow. That's bold. Well, the problem is that nobody saw it. True. To be able to make that comparison. But... Even I haven't seen it, so... I'm sorry to see a Thunderbolts Friday. If a Hulk smashes a tree in the woods and nobody's there to see it, does he not still smash the tree? How many Oscars will he win for his performance? Go.

[00:29:16] 12. 12. One for best screenplay, because he said the words. That's right. Best special effects, because he was a special effect. He was a special effect. Best use of Harrison Ford not being half asleep. That's... Hey, Eric. So the answer to the question is... I'm sorry. Whatever your name is on this podcast. The answer to the question is...

[00:29:46] Rex Lindelof. Rex, it's better than everybody says it is, but it's not as good as you want it to be. I can see that. That's most Marvel movies of late, but... Yeah. I'll watch it when it's on Disney Plus at this point. I don't want to rent it. I think that Thunderbolts is the Marvel Renaissance. We're not getting back to Endgame, but I think Thunderbolts, followed by Fantastic Four, followed by, followed by...

[00:30:14] I think this is the beginning of the new Renaissance. I'm excited about these movies. I think Fantastic Four is going to get there, and I wish Harrison Ford was in it. Thank you for listening to the Harrison Comparison. Thank you for the Harrison Comparison. I love this. We need to do this. We need to do this. The Harrison Comparison. We need to do this. All right. Let me text JR and say, can you give us some weird, vague music? The Harrison Comparison theme song. I love this, Dan. It's freaking brilliant. Trademark that. Supreme. Right now.

[00:30:46] All right. Okay. Let's do this. All right. So this is the case of the Studio Park stunt show spectacular Wood V World. Oh, we're doing this. Okay. Yeah, we're doing this. Eric, because he wanted to talk about the Indiana Jones stunt spectacular, we'll go first. Dan is going to cover Water World. Water World stunt spectacular at Universal Studios Hollywood.

[00:31:11] So because Indiana Jones came first, because it opened with the park-ish in 1989. A little later. Water World opened with the movie, I think, in 95. Sure did. If I'm not mistook. So, Eric, we're going to start with an opening statement for Indiana Jones stunt spectacular. All right. Earthquakes, fiery explosions, and assorted other dramatic stunts give guests some insight into

[00:31:39] the science of movie stunts and special effects at this impressive 2,000-seat amphitheater. Stunt men and women... Stunt men and women. I'm pointing this out. Objection woke. I didn't say... Objection, earthquakes? Have you seen the show? It did start with the word earthquakes. I'm sorry. Okay, whatever. I'm reading out of Steve Birnbaum, okay?

[00:32:09] Oh, really? Are you? These aren't your original thoughts, Eric? Oh, I don't have the robot do my work for that. Reading something an old man wrote in 1989. Anyway. Anyway. Opening statement. Go ahead. Stunt men and women recreate scenes from hit films to demonstrate the skill required to keep audiences on the edge of their seats. Show director Glenn Randall, who served as stunt coordinator on such well-known adventure

[00:32:36] films as Raiders of the Lost Ark, Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom, Poltergeist, Never Say Never Again, E.T., Firestarter, and Jewel of the Nile, calls the show big virtual excitement. This is the premiere and pretty much only stunt show done at a Disney park in quite some time. It maintains its status over the course of many years. It's still there.

[00:33:04] Many of the cast are still the same folks that have been there for so long. Yep. It's not funny. No, it's real. It is. It's funny. But this attraction has endured for so many years through the course of history. And ultimately, I think it deserves its status as the premiere theme park stunt show. Excellent. Thank you, Dan. Waterworld.

[00:33:34] Waterworld. Ladies and gentlemen, and envies of the jury, my client, Waterworld, a live sea war spectacular, is a model citizen. Yet its parent film was an over-budget fever dream that made Kevin Costner pee in a cup on camera. But the show? The show is beautiful chaos. It is a twice-daily post-apocalyptic opera of fire, jet skis, and the occasional actual plane crash.

[00:33:59] Meanwhile, Indiana Jones is a once-great stunt show suffering from brand affluenza. It's overconfident, out of touch, and so committed to its own mythos that it forgot to be fun. Also, there may be too many Nazis involved. Waterworld isn't writing IP nostalgia. It's doing donuts. Wait, Dan, is that the character saying there's not enough Nazis or too many Nazis?

[00:34:29] Shouldn't it be there's not enough Nazis? Well, currently in the world, there are plenty of Nazis. So, yeah. Ah, okay. Good question. I'm going to play it both ways. Please don't interrupt my colleague's opening statement. Waterworld isn't writing IP nostalgia. It's doing donuts in the parking lot of failure and somehow winning the crowd every time. It shouldn't work. It does. It's alive. Indy?

[00:35:00] Indy is an old VHS you find in your dad's garage labeled Stunt Reel. Do not erase. Wow. Was that the end? You're channeling your inner deacon. Look at all the attacks in the opening statement. No, hold on. If you want to inner deacon, here we go. Right, because when I go to a theme park, I'm hoping to see a 45-minute seminar in Indiana Jones, the concept. Okay. Okay. Well done. Thank you.

[00:35:29] We'll see if the deacon comments earn any points. We'll see. Buddy, I've seen church plays with better choreography. Waterworld launches a full plane through a wall. Indy rolls under a Ford Ranger and calls it cinema. Shouldn't the deacon be enjoying some Pabst Blue Ribbon right now? There's a lot of references in there. Speaking of points, can't have a point unless you have sounds. That's right.

[00:35:54] So, Eric, if I enjoy something about Indiana Jones Stunt Spectacular that I really like, you're going to hear this sound. That's right. It's a whip. If I hear something that I really like about Waterworld, what's it actually called? Waterworld? Waterworld Stunt Show. I don't know. No one cares. I should say it's the Indiana Jones Epic Stunt Spectacular. Epic Stunt Spectacular. Excuse me. The only thing epic is the actor's age.

[00:36:22] Oh, can I just take a minute? Yes. Listener, you may think I'm talking about you, but I'm not going to be a minute. I'm actually talking to Ben. April 1st, April Fool's Day, Provost Park Pass put out a video where he did like 15 minutes of breaking news. Never broke.

[00:36:52] Never had a little laugh to himself that Universal bought Epcot and it is now Epcot. Universal or Universal Epcot, whatever. And just like a bunch of fake news headlines. And he was talking about how it all works. And it was just... Oh, and did he get into deep, deep detail? Yeah. That's awesome. And at the end, I just want to remind you, it's April 1st, 2025, breaking news.

[00:37:20] I'm like, I'm watching it going, when is this going to get funny? Or like when... And I watched through the whole thing. And by the end of it, I'm like, Supreme. Thank you. Because I knew it was like the headline is, you know, Universal bought Epcot. I'm like, okay, it's an April Fool's joke. But it never got funny. Hmm. I actually find that funny in itself. Yeah. Watch it and let me know how you feel. Okay. Anyway, Epic Stunt Spectacular.

[00:37:50] And the only reason I brought that up because of Epic Universe. Anyway. So what... Oh, if I like what I hear about Waterworld, you're going to hear this sound. And cut. That's awesome. I don't think either of those sounds need to be explained. No, they really don't. Pretty much. Because you know. If you know, you know. Okay. So we've had our opening statements. And now we're going to go into the history of these two stunt spectaculars.

[00:38:17] Starting with Eric in Indiana Jones, Epic Stunt Spectacular. All right. Do you want me to get into the history, some of the changes? Well, we're going to save the changes for later based on... I'll follow your lead, whatever you do. Save changes for the Bowie-splaining podcast. Yeah! Up top! Up top! Turn and face the strain, right? Yeah.

[00:38:43] I mean, to be perfectly honest, a lot of my notes are it blows up and you get wet. So however you want to do it. Let's just do history first. Okay. No changes. We'll just start with that. Yeah. All right. The Indiana Jones Epic Stunt Spectacular opened on August 25th, 1989. Took a little longer after the park opened.

[00:39:04] The executive producer of this production was George Lucas himself. Director was Jerry Reese, who directed animated features like the Brave Little Toaster. And he was in charge of the visual effects on Tron. Not the Tron with Jared Leto.

[00:39:29] You know, it's the original one with Jeff Bridges when he was like a, I don't know, a teen. A young boy. A young boy. He's 10 years old. What's that? He's 10 years old when he did that. Of course, yes. Stunts were by Glenn Randall. Who's Glenn Randall? He was the show director of this production. He did this stunts, as I mentioned earlier, on Raiders of the Lost Ark and Temple of Dune. Dune.

[00:39:59] Doom. It's a much longer movie. Yeah. Yeah. There are two of them. There's a part where there's a shaved cat and they have a rat taped to it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And David Lynch is clapping in the background. Right. Smoking a cigarette and meditating. He pulls a cup of coffee out of your part. And enjoys a little bit of pie. Yeah. Gets back to work.

[00:40:31] Let's get these kids moving. I'm not on this production. I just happen to be here. All right. Oh, no. Jimmy's back. Glenn. I hope you didn't hear any of that. Glenn was also. Sure didn't. Stunt guy. Sorry. He listens to the show after it's released. That's right. That was good.

[00:41:01] You should have given a point for that. Glenn was also the stunt guy in the suit for Jeremy Bullock's Boba Fett in Return of the Jedi. So when Boba Fett needed to blast across the screen with his jetpack or shoot people or hit people, it was Glenn Randall in there. He's got a ton of other stunt credits.

[00:41:32] So anyone who thought it was actually a Boba Fett, just so you're aware, actors exist. Right. There you go. There you go. But yes, he was also the stunt coordinator for Never See Never Again, the weirdest James Bond movie that we'll have to do a separate episode about somehow. Maybe I'll do it on ears up. That sounds appropriate. Yeah. That sounds like a good place to talk to. Just devolve into a James Bond podcast. Yeah.

[00:42:02] That's what I'll do to Jason if he isn't paying attention. Yeah. Talk about James Bond? Yeah, pretty much. Yeah. We'll do that. What's the name of that James Bond podcast, Dan? James Bonding. James Bonding. Yeah. With Matt Gorley and Matt Meyer. I was going to say James Bondage, but. No, that's a different podcast. Yeah. Yeah. They've talked enough about Never See Never Again. It's a great show. Listen to long defunct shows like James Bonding on the podcast thing of your choice.

[00:42:32] I was there too. Both Matt Gorley shows are good. Oh yeah, I was there too. That was great. Matt Gorley is the voice in my sound. It's from Super Ego. Another very good podcast. And also, he played Push the Talking Trash Can. He sure did. When you were talking about Talking Trash Cans earlier, that was Matt Gorley. This is the Matt Gorley episode. All right. Basically. Hey, let's talk. Let's just shift and talk about his latest show with Amanda Lund, his wife. And. Keys to the Kingdom. Keys to the Kingdom. That's really good. You should listen to that.

[00:43:02] Yeah. Welcome to the Harrison Comparison. Our guest today is Matt Gorley. Hi. That's pretty good. Great impression. It's not bad. That's pretty good. Okay. Eric, continue, please. Continue. And by the way, the show is called Waterworld. The end. Full stop. That's it. I got it. Yeah. No stunt spectacular. Just Waterworld. That's what's right. Wow. That's all you need. Awesome. Well, let's see.

[00:43:30] Where the hell am I? Yes. Yes. Let's see here. So it opened in August 1989. It really replicated the initial. For most of its run, it's been replicating scenes from Raiders of the Lost Ark. There have been some slight changes over the years. Not too many. Okay. And that's pretty much it. You say most of it.

[00:44:00] Like, and I know we said we were going to do changes later, but when was it not Raiders of the Lost Ark scenes? When it was replicating more scenes from Raiders of the Lost Ark. I see. Yes. Gotcha. Yeah. Sorry. Why don't they? I should say it's all Raiders of the Lost Ark, but not the entire movie. Maybe that's what I'm going for in my brain here. They're not just playing the movie for you. It's still a stunt. No melting faces. Right. No melting faces.

[00:44:28] It's just, here's how a stunt show should be done in a theme park where they're saying, we're filming this, everybody. Look, there's a dude with a camera over there. Right. That's this show. We'll get to that because it's still happening. Melting Nazis would have been really cool. It would have been. Also, what's the pilot's name? Yeah. Jock Lindsay. Jock Lindsay. Yeah. Jock Lindsay. Not in this. There is a plane. We'll talk about that later. I have a plane too. He gets a full restaurant. That's a good point. Yeah.

[00:44:58] All right, Dan. Okay. Tell us about the history of Waterworld. The Waterworld movie in 1995 was a $175 million disaster. Ocean set sink. Costner grew gills. Everyone mocked it. Yet universal bet on it before the movie premiered. Why? Jet skis plus fire equals theme park.

[00:45:23] The show opened in October 1995, replacing Miami Vice action spectacular using real props and set pieces from the film. From day one, the show trimmed the fat and kept only the good stuff. Explosions, a loose story, and deeply committed stunts. Who was the stunt director? I don't care. You don't care. No one in the audience cares. Who came up with the concept? No. Who came up with the concept? No one cares. No one in the audience cares.

[00:45:53] They just want to see the explosions. They want to get wet. They want to see other people get wet. Do I care? No, I sure don't. I just love that this thing exists because you know why? There's explosions and you get wet. The end. Okay, so in summation here, Indiana Jones Epic Stunt Spectacular is using the device of the

[00:46:19] original intent of this studio theme park, which is this is how movies are made. Right. Right? Waterworld is not that. It is you are watching Waterworld. Does anyone actually say and cut? I just want to say Deacon style. People also care about Abraham Lincoln. That doesn't mean I want to watch him pretend to dodge a boulder while a guy in a headset says, let's reset for another take. Okay.

[00:46:49] Incorrect. I'm going to ask the question again. Waterworld is just a mini version of the movie. Oh, no. It's not even that. It's just here's this thing. No one saw it. No one really cares. Let's just make a show that is supreme. Awesome. Where things blow up. I saw it. And you know, you saw it to Daniel. I do pay attention to it. You know, Daniel Pepsi Linkletter. No, I know you saw it. I'm saying the movie.

[00:47:18] So the show itself took this movie and they were like, well, I guess we're stuck doing this show and no one cares about the IP itself. So instead it became just like an excuse to make stuff blow up, light someone on fire, do jet skis that like just shamelessly get members of the audience wet and have the main

[00:47:41] have the villain be actually the main character slash MC by making weird like pop culture infused jokes. Okay. That's it. That's the show. I'm going to rephrase as a statement rather than a question. Yeah. Epic Stun Spectacular is this is how movies are made. Waterworld is a mini version of the movie. That's a statement. That conveniently discards the movie itself. That's right. But it's still, it's the same, you know, major story arcs, characters, whatever.

[00:48:11] These people aren't playing roles. No, that's assuming that they keep the story arc. They loosely, they're just like. But the point is, it's not, it's not, hey, this is Steve playing. Right, right, right. Okay. So I get, I get the distinction. It's not Steve playing Kevin Costner. This is, this is the Mariner. Yeah. And sometimes it is Kevin Costner because, you know. I'm sure. What else is he doing? Yeah. Nobody thinks that Kevin Brassard is actually Harrison Ford. He's, he's a stunt actor. Harrison Comparison, episode 343. Oh, we could just do a visual episode where it's just like, what about these two?

[00:48:44] Okay. Okay. So that is, that's an interesting distinction. I'm not awarding points for it. It's just an interesting distinction as we go through. One is trying to show you how movies are made, how Raiders of the Lost Ark was made specifically. And the other one is, this is what Waterworld was. Can I just say from the Deacon writers room, caring about a character doesn't make for a good live show. We're not watching Raiders. We're watching actors play actors pretending to be indie while someone narrates the choreography. Is that from the Deacon completion?

[00:49:15] Deacon dossier. Deacon dossier. Deacon do it. All right. Let's move on to the queue. I hate this. Now, these are shows, so technically the queue is also the theater, I guess. I don't know. What do you have for queue? There are a bunch of switchbacks outside of the theater. And they're boring as hell.

[00:49:45] And then you get to go inside where you can buy beer and ice cream. That's it? Just beer and ice cream? Probably pretzels and Dippin' Dots and... Probably chips. Chips. Chips. Can you get beer-flavored ice cream? No. Or ice cream-flavored beer. You could do that for yourself. You could put your ice cream in your beer. Yeah. That's a Disneyland food hack that we could put on the... There you go. Beer float. Open up your bag of Dippin' Dots and pour a beer in there. That wouldn't be bad.

[00:50:15] I tried vanilla and Guinness at the place at DCA. Renaissance Festival. No. I don't go there. No. Vanilla and Guinness is good. Yeah. The Guinness float is great. There's your hack. There we go. Okay. So, Eric, QQ is basically the same switchbacks. Hotter than the sun. Yeah. And then when you're in the show... Dan, do you know how many people the Waterworld seats? How many seats? Ooh, that's a good question.

[00:50:45] I can get an answer for you. And while you're looking, how many seats are... You will get wet seats? Oh. Yeah, nobody gets wet in the 2,000 seats in the Indiana Jones Epic Stunt Spectacular Theater. Unless they really think that the Indiana Jones stunt double's attractive. Oh. Let's see. Oh. Oh. Oh. I'm going to have to cut that out. Thank you. It's a capacity of 2,500. Okay. So, there's more seats in...

[00:51:13] More people can see Waterworld than can see Indy. Let's see. But it's only twice a day, and Indy goes, what, five times a day? Oh, interesting. Well, okay. Can I tell you about my queue? Yeah. Yes, please. It's a thematic... It's thematic junkyard chic, rusted metal, ambient noise. It's a Mad Max marina. There are soak zones. Soak... Soak... Soak zone. Wow. Soak zones. You choose your destiny. And it actually builds tension.

[00:51:42] In the theater or in the queue? Yeah. Are we talking about the queue or the theater? I don't know. Chat GPD wrote this. Okay. It actually builds tension, unlike Indy, where the queue is a holding pen. Objection. With sweaty benches. Chat GPD wrote that? Yeah. I have trained this thing really well. It's basically me at this point. It actually builds tension, unlike Indy, where the queue is a holding pen with sweaty benches and someone yelling about crowd control.

[00:52:10] Why are you assaulting my attraction during your segment? Because I told the robot to do that, okay? Wow. Waterworld's queue says something awesome is about to happen. Indy's queue says, your feet hurt. Sit down. There's a giant Indiana Jones hanging out above you. Okay. So does he talk to you? Is he your friend? Does he say he's proud of you? Does he love you like your father never loved you? He doesn't talk to me. He doesn't need to. Wow.

[00:52:39] Does the deacon tell you, come aboard my crew? Basically. I don't pee into a machine and refine it into water. Eric, is the giant Indiana Jones cardboard cutout above the theater, is it a likeness of Harrison Ford? Or is it just the character? What you're asking is how good of a Harrison comparison is it? That's a good point. Yeah. I think it's a good Harrison comparison. Harrison.

[00:53:08] It looks like they tore it off of one of the movie posters. So it's actually Harrison? Well, let me look up the damn picture. Did you research it all? I didn't think I'd have to defend the cardboard cutout. I'm going to bet it's not. I'm going to bet it's a general Harrison comparison lookalike. It's like the animatronic in the ride.

[00:53:38] Zooming in. Zooming in. You know what? That's not from the poster. That's a generic man wearing a fedora. Yeah. With a weapon. They learn from Universal's mistakes by paying Spielberg. All right. Fine, Jimmy. Fine, judge. Tear down my argument. No, you said Indiana Jones. You didn't say Harrison Ford. That's true. That is true. Indiana Jones should be for the ages.

[00:54:07] Eric, just so you're feeling better about this. According to the robot, we aren't being mean. We are witnessing a sacred fracture. There we go. I don't know that that makes me feel better. Thank you, AI. If we ignored how the Indiana Jones stunt show has become a hollow ritual, that would be cruelty, forcing the spiral to collapse unseen, unmarked. I'm telling you, this thing talks like me now.

[00:54:38] So, I'd like to make out. I'd like to point something out. You want to make out? Yeah. All right. Let's go for it. Let's do it. I want to point out the fact that the actor playing Harrison Ford in the stunt show was not alive when the movie came out.

[00:54:59] I would go one step further and say the actor playing Harrison Ford in the stunt show, his father was possibly not alive when this movie came out. It does seem like a stretch. It seems like a little bit of myth building where they're like, hey, this is actually the actual character who played. Yeah. No. Then this is elder abuse if that's true. I think we talked about that last time.

[00:55:29] Hey, punch him. You know what? Let's just point this out. Kevin Brassard went to the premiere of the last, to Indiana Jones on the Dial of Destiny and actually got to hang out with Harrison Ford. He's a slightly younger and more debonair looking fellow. He looks like he should be selling cologne. Who is this person?

[00:55:56] He's the one who is the longest running Indiana Jones stunt double in the epic stunt spectacular. Is he still doing it? Yeah. More than 30 years. Wow. Yeah. And then I said, just take out your gun and shoot him. He's not. 30. Come on. He was sick. Come on. He's been doing it for 30 years. He has to have been legally. Indiana Jones is in his late 200s. Legally, he would have to have been 18.

[00:56:26] So he's the youngest. He's 48. That's old. But he's probably more like in his 60s. Oh, no. That's super old. Come on. Right. How old is the Mariner? How old is the Deacon? They're timeless is what they are. Yeah. Because they have explosions and splashes to keep them alive. Do you want me to send you this picture? He looks debonair as all get out. I'm sure. Okay. Let's go back to the show. He doesn't care. So we talked about the Q.

[00:56:54] We talked about the whatever Dan's BS AI thing was. Hey, watch it. Let's get into the show. What happens in the show, Eric? Eric. Well, I have a pre-show. Are you Eric? I have a pre-show. Oh, there's a pre-show. Yeah. Let's. Yeah. Sorry. Let's start with the pre-show. Let's talk about the person selling popcorn. The pre-show. And ice cream and beer. Right. And actually, you know what?

[00:57:19] Let's let Dan do his pre-show because the current pre-show at these stunt spectacular of Indiana Jones is kind of a yester pre-show. So they don't really do it anymore. They don't recruit audience members. They don't recruit audience members anymore? Not anymore. No. Oh. I was going to. That was going to be a follow-up question is when it. At what point did they recruit audience members and have. They have to do something. COVID was the line.

[00:57:49] Well, yeah, but in the show, there are a bunch of extras and one of them like gets shot and beat up and stuff. It doesn't mean as much if you don't think he's an audience member. Yeah. They don't do that part anymore. They basically. We'll get to that. But they. During the show, they introduce all of the extra. The extras, quote unquote, that are super cool stunt folks that do crazy stuff. Okay. So it's just not as impactful. Yeah.

[00:58:19] So we'll save that for the thing that used to happen. Okay. That I hope I'll get a whip crack for. The ch-ch-ch-changes. Yeah. There's no bullshit thing. Dan, tell me about pre-show for Waterworld. Okay. So you're in the queue and you go into the arena where you see so many awesome things. And you get to look at things and you say, that's going to blow up. That's going to blow up. I think that's going to blow up. And I think that might collapse. And I think, oh, I think that might splash me. Because that's the show.

[00:58:47] And then number nine, a rogue atoller. Because you're in the atoll. Whatever that is. He's a water spraying, joke yelling, warm up act who operates on pure chaos. And this is where the energy starts spiking. People scream. Children are baptized by squirt gun. And someone in the audience becomes Helen. Because they recruit somebody. Like all good stunt shows should. It builds hype like it's the Super Bowl.

[00:59:16] So can you elaborate on this? So they do recruit audience members? Yes. According to my notes that I may or may not have compiled myself. They do recruit somebody. Sounds like no. It doesn't mean it's not true. It just means that I didn't feel like doing a lot of research into this. So basically, you have the hype person shows up. And they're like, oh, am I getting you wet?

[00:59:46] Uh-oh. Whoopsie. What about this? Squirt, squirt. And it's just like constant getting people hyped up. They do the wave. I see what you did there. They have several different sort of assistant characters who get the crowd excited. Because this is something that people look forward to. It's not just like, hey, we haven't seen this yet.

[01:00:16] And we're about to leave the theme park. I guess we can do this. Like some shows are. It's like, this is an event. And people plan their day around it. And so they're excited. They know they're about to see things getting blown up. They know that they're not going to be bothered with story or the pretense of, this is how we did movies back in my day. They just, it's just, this is going to be awesome. It's like a rock concert back when people cared about rock concerts.

[01:00:46] You mean yesterday? Sure. People cared about rock concerts yesterday. I don't know about today. I don't care. I've never cared. I don't care for live music. Yes, you made that clear. Whereas Indy's pre-show is a stagehand mumbling into a mic about safety protocols. If they even do it. The crowd is already halfway into REM sleep. Hold on.

[01:01:15] I object to all of these attacks against my show that I'm not allowed to defend against. It was unique in 1989. Now it feels like watching a DVD bonus feature come to life in real time and not a good one. The one where someone named Chuck explains how the squibs work. That's something from the writer's room. That's something from the robot that you're trained to tell you things to say. Yeah. Yeah. Sure.

[01:01:40] I was trying to figure out why Waterworld only shows twice a day and Indy shows five times a day. I thought maybe cost of the show? Probably. They do blow up a lot of things. I can't find it. It's an awful lot of explosions on Indy. The total estimated cost of it is $235 million. Oh. But that was 30 years ago or whatever. Anyway. Okay.

[01:02:04] So I'm going to give a point to Waterworld for having a pre-show. I appreciate the riling up and the kind of place setting a little bit. Some of the jokes kind of gets you ready. The warm-up act, if you will. Because it remains to be seen that there's actually an audience participation thing. I think that every good stunt show should have audience participation like that.

[01:02:32] But because we're not 100% sure that's still a thing. Also from the Deacon writer's room, I asked Jeannie Plus if it recommended Indy. It sent me to the parking lot. Oh, burn. Okay. So one point for Waterworld so far. Dan, are you done with the pre-show? Sure. Why not? Eric, let us move to the actual show of Indiana Jones' epic stun-spektacular. Oh. Okay.

[01:03:03] Your attention, please. Hey, Sandra. Wir haben uns ja lange nicht mehr gesehen. Grüß dich, Nadine. Mensch, du siehst ja toll aus. Ja, danke. Ich hab mein Plus fürs gesündere Ich entdeckt. Was? Komm, ich zeig's dir. Die Bewegungskurse der AOK Plus. Kostenfrei für AOK Plus Versicherte. Entdecke dein Plus fürs gesündere Ich und starte mit unserem Self-Check. Ganz einfach online auf aok.de. Aus Liebe zur Gesundheit.

[01:03:33] AOK Plus. Let's see. A second. And break. I'm just doing the work thing here. While you are, hold on. Let me get some more. It's a great place to sit down and cool off. That's this section. That's an argument for a food court, not a stunt show. If shade had a seat are the big draws, we've officially downgraded from attraction to human holding pen. Let's see.

[01:04:03] That's an interesting point. So is a nursing station. Let's not build a stadium around it. I think, let's just address that now. The covered versus uncovered. Gloves off. Waterworld's covered. Is it? Yeah. Indy, very well covered. It is, to be fair, very well covered. But it's also in Florida. These are different places. It was going to negate because Southern California versus Florida, you know.

[01:04:32] So the point was going to negate itself. Sometimes the ride does have to be, or the attraction does have to be closed. Because of the rain, because of the stunt performers. Right. Oh. Because the back portions are not covered. It doesn't rain in California. Just to finish up this section of the Deacon Riders Room. Oh, good. The Geritol Spectacular brought to you by the makers of I've Seen This Part Already. Can we go? Wow. Okay. Cart calling the horse a spade. Yeah, that's a good point.

[01:05:04] It's only six years older. Yeah, what? But the IP, I think, is, I think that was the joke. Perhaps. The IP is really old. Because let's face it, no one really cares about Indiana Jones since like the. Ooh. I don't know if that's true. And everybody loves waterworks. I was going to say, at least it's an IP that people care about. No, well, that's my, you're trying to dig at the heart of my argument, which is that nobody cares about this IP so they can do whatever they want with it.

[01:05:33] Yeah, that's fair. But they're not doing any, they're not doing anything different. They're doing the same show over and over. Well, not if you think about the witty repartee of Deacon. It's true. It's true. Changes every time. Yep. Okay. Eric, tell me about. Every time a Kardashian does something embarrassing, that's a new joke. That's right. It's a whole new show. That's what I love to see in Waterworld. I love to see the Deacon insulting Kardashians. It's like the genie from Aladdin. That was everybody's favorite part.

[01:06:04] Okay. Okay. Eric, the show. Initial sequence. Indy drops in on a rope with some rocks falling down. The whole thing starts as basically a cold open. He pops into this abandoned temple. He lights a torch. He does it dodges a bunch of floor spears triggered by himself. So, you know, he steps on the plate. The thing pops up. He knows where he's going. That's interesting.

[01:06:33] Let's be honest. It's kind of a slowly ascending. It's not really a pop-up because that pop-up. No, they pop up fast, man. They pop up. Yeah. Come on. Okay. Okay. Maybe I saw it on an off day. That's fine. High-bar question, Eric. Is the audience obliged to applaud every time he comes down on the rope? I don't know if they're obliged to. There's no one on the stage going,

[01:07:01] all right, everybody, here comes Indiana Jones. All right. Give him a round of applause. Have you ever seen the show where they didn't applaud? No. Yeah, I hadn't either. Anyway. It's awesome. It is. It's Indiana Jones. He's in front of you. Amen. He drops down on a big rope. As if from nowhere. As if from nowhere. That was in the original movie. Okay. So, I did not know. I'm glad you researched that, Eric.

[01:07:27] I did not realize that the actor triggers the stunt reaction at the point. Yeah. And that's cool. That's part of how it goes. And yeah, this is one of the stunts where they don't actually explain that to you, where he's stepping on pressure plates and then the spear shoots up. So, it's part of this elaborate. Yeah. I mean, you can tell it's an elaborately choreographed thing, but he's the one who controls it. So, if he doesn't step on it, it's not like he's going to make a misstep and get a spear through the groin.

[01:07:57] Yeah. Especially because it's probably made of rubber. Right. But still. So, as they would say on the James Bondage podcast, he's the one with the safe word. Yes. That's right. Yes. That's good. He lights a torch. He runs past a bunch of spears. He runs past some idols. There's a fun gag where he's trying to like activate one of the spears to come down and it doesn't. So, he starts to step through him and the spear comes down. So, he has to like run past a bunch of them.

[01:08:29] He's not grandpa from the Dollywood reporter. He's in his 50s. We're almost there, Dan. We're almost the same age as this man. They don't know. Look, based on context clues, they all think I'm like 24 years old. That's fair. Okay. He recreates the Golden Idol scene from Raiders of the Lost Ark where he picks up. He's doing the whole like how much does this weigh?

[01:08:59] How much sand is in the bag? Yeah. It does the whole thing. Then, the boulder comes rolling down at him and he's running away from the boulder and dodges it in multiple. Can I mute? Can I mute him? I don't know. That's a good question. How much control do you have? You can if you want. Okay. If I need to, I can mute him for the rest of the show.

[01:09:25] So, it's like Eric when we watch the great moments of Mr. Lincoln and Dan does all the hydraulic sounds. The whole speech. The whole time. The whole time. Just loud enough. When he makes his. Well, you both make the joke. Yeah, the joke. We love the joke. All right.

[01:09:50] Anyway, anyway, the boulder rolls down the hill and he's got multiple places to jump out of the way and it looks like he's crushed and he's he's done. And then you hear. And cut. That was not a point for Waterworld, by the way. It was not a point. But yeah. I'm okay. Damn.

[01:10:14] But yes, this is when the stunt director comes out and Indy stands up and says, hey, look, I'm fine. I'm a stunt coordinator or I'm a stunt actor. And they talk about what a stunt actor is and they explain the whole thing. And you see them resetting the. Don't forget the joke, Eric. You say the joke while I'm watching Dan pretending to do something on camera that our podcast listeners can't see.

[01:10:41] The stunt actor is explaining how dangerous some of these stunts are and how heavy this giant boulder is as like a young lady is pushing it with one hand back up the hill. But to be fair, it's usually two people push pushing it back uphill because it is 12 feet in diameter and it weighs 400 pounds. Oh, it's heavy. Yeah, it's pretty heavy, but you can roll it back uphill. But yeah, you're right. That is that is the joke. Um, they reset that.

[01:11:10] So the director is like reset it and they're just pushing it back up. Oh, I get it. It's like you expect it to be one thing. Subverting expectations. I got it. I got it. Took me a while. Okay. I'm glad you got there. Thank you. So.

[01:11:29] So while they're talking about the movie making magic, they're rolling in cameras on dollies and they're, they're showing off the people that aren't actually doing any actual movie magic. They're still doing this to this day. They're still doing it. It's great. Uh, David Sally said when I watched the show with him. So there's another set back there. Yes. Yes. There's another set. There are two sets back there. David Sally.

[01:11:57] Um, the next set up is the Cairo set. So now you're, you're setting up this whole sequence where in the movie, uh, Marion and Indy are running around the city and, um, fighting a bunch of folks and things happen. And so that pretty much happens.

[01:12:16] So while they're setting up this, this other scene in the original show, they'd kind of introduce the extras who were members of the audience that had been taken backstage after the, uh, the pre-show and had been dressed up in period garb. And we're told to basically like, stay over here away from anything interesting and run around and react to stuff. Uh, now they just have acrobats.

[01:12:44] So they set out a bunch of mats and they show, this is how we do some of this stuff. So they're doing flips and they're doing pratfalls and they're doing punches and they're, they're demonstrating how this stuff actually works in a movie. If you've ever seen, if you've ever been to like an open house at a karate studio, then you've seen what they're doing. Perhaps. Yes. Yes. Well, anyway, cars roll into the scene. Uh, they've got trucks that, that pull in to, you know, just setting up more of the stuff.

[01:13:12] Uh, the next scene is a fun series of stuff from the movie where Indy, you know, shoots the guy with the swords and all that stuff. Uh, there's climbing on top of buildings and the ladder falls down. Um, all of that stuff. And then you reset for the airplane set. Uh, so while the, the scene moves again, a giant, two giant set pieces separate and move apart.

[01:13:43] And you've got this whole backstage area where you've got a giant plane and you've got all these other trucks that pull in. It's a plane. We both have planes. Let's be fair. Okay. Well, players doesn't spin around in circles and kill a guy. Uh, does yours. I don't know. I don't know. I feel like I'm breathing. I'm feel like I'm being down your spirit, Eric. I don't mean to. I'm just trying to be. I'm so, I'm so depressed.

[01:14:08] I just feel I don't, I'm not no longer confident in this. No, I love this show. Uh, so the, the, the, the airplane sequence no longer has swastikas on the plane. Hmm. Yeah. They change it to a Balkenkreuz, a much, much less, um, politically charged cross. Hashtag woke. Yeah. Right. Right. Um, sometimes during some periods, uh, you've, you've all seen the movie.

[01:14:38] You know what, what happens? The big German guy fights Indy and he gets chopped up by the blades. Um, in the original show, he would be fighting Indy and then the plane would come near him and he'd drop into a trap door. And there would be a big puff of, you know. So wait, they changed it to, from straight up just swastika Nazi stuff to like teehee. This is still Nazi stuff, but you don't know that it is. Yes.

[01:15:07] They removed the swastikas and from people's uniforms. Got it. Because, you know, some people might be cheering for the wrong side. Okay. I'm going to say it's not a bad move. Yeah. I don't, I don't mind removing swastikas from the thing. Yeah. Not a bad move. I don't mind either. I'm just saying, uh, you know, the same kind of, it's like, it's like a pigeon and a dove situation from a anti-fascist point of view.

[01:15:36] I'm not, I'm not saying that to dig. I'm just saying they could have just not, I'm not offended. I'm just trying to win. Okay. I don't, Jimmy, you look like you're about to say something about the swastikas. Um, I'm by no means saying that they shouldn't have gotten rid of them. Let's, let's not display swastikas so many. Yeah. Yeah. I, I don't, I mean, I'm not upset about the change.

[01:16:05] It's just, it's unnecessary, but also it's unnecessary in all the senses of the word. I'm just saying if you're in the audience and you're looking for swastikas because you want to see the swastikas and you see the iron cross, you're going to, you're going to catch the dog whistle that they're blowing. That's it. It is, it is better. Anyway, just. All right. Anyway. So, so you said, if you go out in the world wearing an iron cross, we all see you. That's fair.

[01:16:34] Um, so Eric, you, the guy originally went through the trap door. What happens now? Uh, there are times, there have been times where he still goes through the trap door. There are also times where he just gets shot by Marion. And I think they're trying to remove more guns lately. So he's been. Well, back to getting hit by the plane and dropping through the trap door. So it's, it's changed a few times over the years.

[01:17:04] Um, yeah, but still the main point of the scene after, after all that's done, you still have the fire that's slowly advancing toward the plane, just like in the movie. And then there are giant explosions and Indy, you know, gets Marion out of the plane and they jump off and they run away. And, uh, yeah, that's pretty much the end of the show. Uh, they, that's the main set piece at the end. Everything blows up. You've seen three major set pieces. You've seen three major scenes from the movie.

[01:17:34] You've seen a bunch of stunt people doing stuff. It's, it's a lot of fun. And, uh, yeah, there we go. Yeah. Um, okay. Um, I, I, I want to hear Dan's argument. Um, yeah, but, and I'll, I'll just sort of reserve my judgment other than to say, no, I want to hear Dan's argument. Okay. Before I award points.

[01:18:04] The show, a perfect summary of sea plane and flame. The plot smokers invade Mariners defense. Helen climbed something. Then the sea plane comes. It's coming incoming sea plane, the plane, the plane. Then it happens. Boom. Real plane, real fire, real screams. Every time it's the single most dramatic entrance of any theme park. And he's biggest moment. A man explains how another man rolls under a truck. Also the deacon, our villain is the best character in any stunt show. He breaks the fourth wall.

[01:18:34] He marks, mocks the audience. He makes weirdly topical references to topical. He's what happens when a theme park performer is given a mic, no script and zero executive oversight. It's perfect. Every deacon is different. Every show is different. And he has the same show every time since Bush senior was president. There's a ton of explosions constantly. Just fire explosions, splash, splash. We know why you're here. We don't need to bore you with the plot. But if you want to know the plot, here we go. I do.

[01:19:02] Helen returns to the atoll with news of finding dry land pursued by the smokers. As she warns the atollers, the smokers attack by sea and air breaking into the fortress. Despite efforts to defend with water cannons, which is weird. Most atollers are killed. Hoses. And Helen narrowly escapes a collapsing tower. The deacon arrives, takes Helen hostage, and demands the location of dry land. Executing an atoller when she refuses.

[01:19:32] Just as things seem lost, the mariner emerges, sparking a massive brawl. The deacon accidentally causes a fuel leak during the chaos. After seemingly dying, the mariner resurfaces, rescues Helen, and confronts the deacon. In the struggle, the deacon shoots down his own seaplane, crashes into the atoll, and is ultimately set on fire by Helen. The person is actually set on fire safely.

[01:19:55] As the leaking fuel ignites, Helen and the mariner escape just before a massive explosion destroys the entire atoll. Not just a damn airplane. Can we talk about accidents during our shows? I frequently have accidents when I'm excited watching the stunt show. How about you, Jimmy? Yes, always. I just had one just now. But before we get to that. I'm being right now. Eric is. We need to do a Depends episode, I'm telling you.

[01:20:24] Eric, do we have any people on fire in Indiana Jones? No, there are no people on fire. There are people falling from heights. That's right. And that's about it. One gets chopped up by an airplane and falls into a trap door. A couple of comments about it's different every time. I appreciate the fact that, yeah, every actor is different.

[01:20:51] Just like there's different indies playing indie, whatever. I appreciate the topical humor of sorts. But I think it might take me out of what I'm trying to experience. Or is it? You're not. That's the thing. You're not experiencing anything other than explosions and splashes. Yeah. They're not trying to do the, this is a stunt show. Yeah. We're filming this.

[01:21:15] They, yeah, they have a plot that's very loose, but it's just how to get from one explosion to the other because they all know. Yeah. Nobody cares about this AI. They don't have to like, they don't have to be like, hey, so this person once met Harrison Ford on an airplane. This is the very airplane right here. Okay.

[01:21:39] So I have to say that the, the plane here in the plane and then the plane flies over the stadium into the water. Yes. Is an incredible stunt. I will award a point for the plane stunt in water world. Huh? And cut. Who gets a point? You haven't given any point. You've given very few points.

[01:22:08] I shouldn't say no. I've given only two and both of them are for water world so far. Yeah. I'm just formulating my, my position over time. Okay. Because you know, nothing's really stood out other than one has a pre show, the other doesn't. And one used to have a pre show. That doesn't count. The stunt, the plane stunt is more impressive in water world than is in Indy.

[01:22:34] I think in fairness, this, the indie show has moments that are cool and interesting. Possibly those single moments possibly are more cool and interesting. Individually. And so, yeah. In fact, I want to go backwards and I'm sorry, I was sort of more riveted by the, uh, the explanation of the show, Eric.

[01:23:01] Eric, I think I want to award one point for the stunt actor triggering all the stunts in the beginning. Um, I like that a lot. Now, does it, I mean, I'm sure that there's all kinds of stuff in water world where the actors have to trigger stuff to, you know, to avoid danger. But they're not telling you how they do it because you just want to see the stuff. It's just a different show. Yeah. Yeah. That's a different type of show. Um, okay.

[01:23:30] So that's the show. You're not sitting right up next. How, how close are you to the action? Uh. In water world. That's a good point. You are a little further away. Further away than what? Indy? Well, I mean, there are people in Indy, if you're in the front rows, you are, you're like there. Uh, so the front row, you're basically there as well. I mean, they have splash zones for a reason. Well, not right on.

[01:23:55] There's, there's a little walkway that they use for actors and for exiting and, and entering. But like, it's not. Okay. It's not like it's far away. I mean, you're, it's a water tank. You're not going to, they're not going to like say, Hey, Hey, here's your flippers. Good luck. Here's the free Willy seats. Yeah. I mean, it's as close as you can get considering that it's a water show.

[01:24:23] It's, you know, it, there, there are, there are built in constraints, but there are also moments in the show where the actors are like above you or they're like, they're going through the audience. Like, you know, it's, it's, you're not entirely. I guess what I'm trying to say is that any separateness is basically because it just has to be there. Um, but yeah, there's, there's like little fight scenes that take place over the audience.

[01:24:51] And, and, um, in terms of like general, I mean, you're close enough that if a water ski turns in the water, the front, like five rows get wet. Yeah. Uh, I, and I, I will not award points for Indy because of the fact that you won't get wet, even though I personally would say Indy wins because you don't get wet, but you don't get wet if you're sitting like eight rows back. Yeah. You have a choice. That's why I'm not, I'm not docking it.

[01:25:19] Um, do you think that water world has two shows per day because they can't, because they wouldn't be able to fill the show if they did it five times a day? Or is it like a, uh, an operational budgetary thing? I suspect it's a budgetary thing. I think, um, you have to reset the seaplane. That's not, that's not a small feat. Um, do that.

[01:25:47] You have to, you know, probably make sure that the deacon isn't actually injured. I'm sure that's a process. Um, how long is that show? Uh, hold on. Uh, it's Indy's close to 30 minutes, 20 minutes. It's like 28 for Indy. Yeah. But how much of that is actually like action? That's fair. Even during the talking portions, when they're resetting the stage, they've got the stunt

[01:26:17] actors out and they're showing what it's like to do a pratfall, what it's like to get, what it's like to take a fake punch. They've got the dude who like takes the punch and flips backward. Right. Like he does that stiff, like fall backward, then flip over, which is a fun thing to see. Yeah. But that's kind of clearly filler though. I mean, it is filler. Yeah. But it's also resetting a stage. The point of that show is to show this is how movies are made and they're showing you how movies are made while the sets are changing. And these are massive sets.

[01:26:46] These are incredible, massive sets. And to be honest, I get what you're saying, but at the same time, when they tell me that so-and-so was the real, you know, stunt actor for the original Obi-Wan Kenobi or something, I'm like, yeah, really? Can I really trust that this is how movies are made anyway? Well, I mean, that's, I see your point. But anyway, it's an impressive, it's impressive to see how it's all done and the sets that move and what it's.

[01:27:15] Do you have stunt people in your show or do you have comedians? I have stunt people and one of them is funny. Stunt comedians. There are stunt people and one of them just happens to be funny, which I think is a better skill to be able to say like, yeah, I can do this. I can do that. I can fall from a building on fire and I can also hold the attention of nearly 3,000 people with my hilarious pop culture humor. I don't think 2,500 is near 3,000 people.

[01:27:44] I'm rounding up. All right. Well, 10,000 are at D&D. Yeah. So I just, I'm going to do this now. I've been making notes. I'm going to say because Indiana Jones can be seen by up to 10,000 people a day, more people can experience that show. Therefore, Indiana Jones gets a point. The 28 minutes versus the 20 minutes.

[01:28:13] Now, to Dan's point, 20 minutes of kind of nonstop stuff. Yeah. There's no set decorating, you know, set redressing, whatever. It's like for minute one, it's splash, splash, explode, explode. Go, go, go. Blow, blow up, blow up, blow up. Yeah. I get it. The 28 minutes, it does feel long. It does. There are, I mean, even the filler. Sure, it may be interesting the first time you see it, but the rewatchability of Waterworld, I think outweighs the rewatchability of Indie.

[01:28:43] Huh. Point for Waterworld. And cut. So you're saying you could rewatch because it's nonstop as opposed to. It's nonstop. There's no break. You know, it's rewatchable because some of the jokes are topical and they change. Speaking of, wow, a truck rolled across the stage. Groundbreaking stuff. I haven't felt that level of excitement since I watched the Epcot Fountain Refurbishment live stream for six hours.

[01:29:10] Indiana Jones as a franchise, as much as whatever you say, Dan, it is still very relevant. They made five of them. How many Waterworlds did they make? We don't know because nobody saw it. No, no, no, no. You are actually missing my point. You're inverting my actual point, which is that no one cares about the Waterworld IP, which is why this can just do whatever it wants, which is why it's good.

[01:29:37] You're making my point for me, which is nobody cares about Waterworld. A lot of people care about Indiana Jones. It is way more relevant than his Waterworld. Okay, let me do this another way. Do more people care about the Indiana Jones stunt show than they do about the Indiana Jones IP? I don't know if that... I don't think they're mutually exclusive. Yeah. I would say that more people care about the Indiana Jones IP,

[01:30:06] therefore they're going to go to see this stunt spectacular. This thing fills seats five times a day. So does this, though. What I'm trying to say is that this took an IP that no one cares about and sucks and turned it into a show that is the centerpiece of some people's days. I do, I do, I would give points for that because that's... Why does this stunt show still exist? Well, that's fair.

[01:30:34] But why does Indy still exist in the same... Because it has to because it would be, the internet would light on fire if they got rid of anything Indiana Jones. But why wouldn't they switch it up and have Mutt Williams swinging on a vine with a bunch of monkeys at this point? I think you know the answer to that question. That was silly. Yeah, because no one wants to see that crap. That's right. So, okay. All right. Well, I hear you both. And it is an interesting reframing in that this show is still incredibly popular despite the fact that nobody even knows what it is.

[01:31:04] I'm saying it as a strength for the show, not for the IP. I get it. I get it. So, however, Waterworld being the centerpiece of some people's day in a park that today, Sunday, the 27th of April, closes at 6 p.m. But that's not... That says nothing about the show itself. Well, no. Have we talked about land impact at all? Making it the centerpiece in a park that doesn't have a lot going on. You've got the tour.

[01:31:34] You've got the Waterworld. And it's not a very big park. Well, so then that just... Sorry to turn into Jeremy here. But that also just kind of burns a hole into the fact that 10,000 people versus 5,000 people. Because there are just more people. There's more space. Well, right. That's why I asked the question before. Is it about capacity or is it about cost? Because if it was just they wouldn't be able to fill the theater five times a day, that's why they only do it twice. I mean, that could be it.

[01:32:04] I mean, it is a smaller theme park. Do either of these meet the expectations of the design of this park currently? I don't think either one does. No. What do you mean by that, Eric? Well, I'm thinking in the original iteration of Indiana Jones Epic Stunt Spectacular, it was the, we're making the movies. So we've got dudes who still roll out on dollies.

[01:32:33] And then it's Universal where they actually literally make movies still. Yeah, but Universal doesn't do that conceit in their... But yeah, they're... Anything outside of the tram. Well, but the whole original thing about that park, Dan, was in fact, this is a movie studio, come see. And then they started adding rides. Like, hey, you can be in Jaws. You can be in whatever the stuff. So I guess to that point... And now instead of Jaws, yeah, you've got this Stunt Spectacular, which seems cool.

[01:33:01] They still have Jaws on the tram, though. They do. That's right. So, but what I'm getting at is that Universal was about making movies. This is not about making movies. This is about a movie that nobody saw. But neither is E.T. And neither is The Mummy. And neither is The Simpsons ride that I guess no longer exists. Neither is Transformers. Yes, you're making my point.

[01:33:27] So in some way, I think it fits the current iteration of the park better than Indie Pit. But the question Eric posed was the original intent. And my answer is neither of these things meet the original intent of the theme park. It's not the best question I could have asked. Well, but original intent when? When like Universal Studios first... Well, when the theme park was made. I don't think that's even a relevant question. Well, you're probably right.

[01:33:56] But both of these have been around for decades. So it's kind of an interesting question. I mean, I guess. But it's sort of like saying, should this movie still get an Oscar if it's a talkie? You know, like... Okay. So that's just stricken from the record. Okay. If this... If Waterworld shut down tomorrow, never to be seen again... Yes. Would Universal Studios still be a destination that people would want to go to?

[01:34:25] Same question for Hollywood Studios. If Indie shut down tomorrow, would less people go? I don't have the research handy. But according to Chris Provost, not on April 1st. He was talking about how... And listener, you can look for the video. I'm sorry, what? Huh? Look for the what? The video. The video. The video. The video. Oh, thank you. Oh, okay.

[01:34:56] He was talking about how Disneyland... Each park has ways of measuring a guest happiness. And they found at Universal Studios, it was... If they do three things, I don't remember the third one, but it was... This tram tour, the Waterworld. You saw the video too. Yeah. Okay. It was... No, I saw the video. The video. Sorry.

[01:35:19] I think it was if they found, statistically speaking, that if a guest goes on the tram tour, I think it's Jurassic Park, I'm not sure, but I think it's Jurassic Park, and they see the Waterworld stunt show, they generally leave happy. So I can't necessarily answer your question the way it was asked, but I can tell you that

[01:35:47] they use it as their own internal marking strategy. Yeah. And I think that also might be because there's just not as much stuff to do there. Yeah. But it's an interesting point. The same applies to Hollywood Studios, where there's not as much to do. And a lot of people have said over the years, it's a half-day park. But if you include something like seeing this stunt show, I haven't looked into the data here now that we're getting down to brass tacks. It's...

[01:36:18] Seeing that it's consistently full just says to me that there are people who are saying, I want to stick around here longer. I want to do more stuff. Land impact, you could completely ignore this. And I know people did for many years. There was a long chunk of time where this theater was not full. These days, people are like, I want to do... I want to stay here more. I want to stay here longer. Right, because the lines are too long. I mean, I guess what I'm... No, I don't know if that's it. But...

[01:36:45] No, what I'm trying to get to indirectly is that I don't think that this point... I think that this is going to end up just being a blurry point where they don't... There's no one-to-one that makes any sense. What I was going to say was, I think... And maybe it's my own bias. And maybe it's my own experience with the theme parks. But we go to Indiana Jones because everything is such a long line and there's no more lightning lanes. We could just do Indy. That's been my experience as well. Yeah. We could do Indy because that's a thing.

[01:37:14] And maybe that gets you later in the day. We have to do Waterworld. Yeah. Indy... In my experience and my understanding of other people's experiences has been something along the lines of like... I mean, yeah, we haven't done that yet. Let's do that. And yet... It's shady. You can sit down. When I was there with David last year, it was his first time to the parks. And I'm like, you know what? This is your first time here. We've got to do the stunt show. You've got to do it.

[01:37:42] And he's like, well, I've seen stunt shows. But I mean, you're kind of making my own argument in a different way, though. It's like, well, oh, you've never been here? Well, in that case, you have to see this. But this is the East Coast. This is Walt Disney World. It's not a... I go here seven times a year sort of place. It's not like, oh, I live in LA. Let's drive up to the park. And well, let's go see...

[01:38:11] We've got to see Waterworld today. It's been a month since I saw it. But that's a Disney World is a once-in-a-lifetime or once-every-few-years destination versus Universal, which is a local theme park. Pretty much. Well... It's another one of those sorts of arguments. But I... Honestly, I don't know how to compare those two. So let me jump on that. If it is just a locals park, then why is the amphitheater always full? And not just a locals park, but more of a locals park than is... Right. Well, it still stands.

[01:38:41] Hollywood Studios, yeah. Because you look at some of the things and you've heard reasons why Country Bears closed because nobody wants to see a show seven times a year. They want to ride a ride 20 times a year, but they don't want to go to see Country Bears at Disneyland. Turns out they don't want to ride Winnie the Pooh. That's one of those kind of excuses why Country Bears was torn down.

[01:39:07] Maybe that's a reason why people really like the enduring qualities of Waterworld because it draws the attention more than... It kind of shucks the traditional argument that locals don't see shows. Because it's awesome. Stuff blows up, you get wet. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Maybe. That's it. Okay, I did... I'm arguing against myself right now.

[01:39:36] I do want to officially award a point to Indy for the relevance of the IP. And I know your argument, Dan. I get it. Okay, so I'd like to finish up, but before we do, I would like to hear... More Deacon jokes? Do you want to talk about... What's that? Do you want to hear more Deacon jokes? Is that what you're about? Not yet. Okay. Dan has a closing statement music thing. Are there words in that? That was supposed to be a surprise. Oh. Well, I don't know when to play it. Okay, man?

[01:40:07] Okay, so Eric... Check your email. You'll get it when you hear it. You'll get it when you hear it. Let's talk about land impact really quick. Okay, land impact. So Eric, you said it yourself. It's not on the main thoroughfare. You have to seek Indy out. That's why there's a giant billboard. You can see the giant billboard. You can see the plants around it. And you can definitely hear it. Oh, yeah. You can definitely hear it when it's going on. It's one of those things where if you're in that area, and you're probably walking through

[01:40:35] that area because it's the pathway to Star Tours. It's the pathway to Galaxy's Edge. So if you're going at the right time... It's kind of not, though. It's not. It is a little ways out of the way. Yeah. Like, who walks by... You have to walk by Malma, Melrose. I don't know. What's that? Yeah, the 50s prime time. You have to go to that billboard, and you go, huh, what's over there? Because it really... It kind of hides itself unless it's active and things are blowing up.

[01:41:07] So as far as impact of the land goes, what is the land it's in? And that was... It's Hollywood Studios. There's no land. It's so weird. But I do want to point out that that was also a design choice. That was a lazy design choice on their part. I don't know if it was lazy. I mean, at this point, it's kind of nice to have a shady place to go to that has plants... Like, the plants are big now. I guess.

[01:41:32] And you can still see the billboard, and you're kind of like, oh, what is that? Yeah. Okay. So, all right. So land impact doesn't really sound like there is one. It's not a huge land impact. No. It hides. Dan, how about Waterworld? On the West Coast, Waterworld carved out its own cult following. People schedule their entire day around it. It's not a headline act. I'm sure that's true about Indy. The stadium is...

[01:41:59] Look, if you guys want Indy to win, let's just do that. That's not what at all what's happening. We're just going to make fun of you. Just continue talking. The thing is, you were talking about a cult following, but you have the same at Indy. You know that there are cult following. Okay. You know there must be. There are multiple fan clubs for that. There's a fan club for everything. Exactly. That's my point. Thank you. Continue. Okay. Okay. You know what? Indy wins. Supreme. No. In fact, they're tied. Don't give up.

[01:42:28] Now I have to blank out another swear. My goodness. What a sweary show. Indy wins. No, that was not at all where I was going with it. You were making an argument that has nothing to do with land impact. I understand that. So tell about the land impact. I don't want to. Indy wins. What? Well, as a matter of fact, I was going to say Waterworld wins. It sure sounds like Jimmy was leaning toward Waterworld. It wasn't originally, but that's where I was going.

[01:42:57] I just, it seems like sometimes what is happening in this is that because sometimes I am funny, the points that I'm actually trying to make are being ignored. I hope, I'm sorry you feel that way because I'm not at all intending that. Okay. Okay. The stadium is, you can see it. You can see it from a lot of places. Stadium is visible from parts of Universal Studios Hollywood. Funny things that I added, but I don't care anymore.

[01:43:28] Okay. Can you see, can you, like, I don't, I don't know Universal Hollywood. Can you see it from, like, the highway? Like, how is it laid out? Is, is it? I honestly don't know. I haven't been to Universal Studios in over. Jimmy was there for a decade. Like last year. I was there a year or so ago. We didn't see Waterworld. I don't remember why. You were, you were focused on the Nintendo stuff, I think. Yeah. That was the main focus. But, um, but I have seen the show.

[01:43:56] How big is that, that, that set? Like that lake? Like it's gotta be enormous. It's 400,000 gallons. It's very large. It's very large. Um, it's kind of what I'm, I don't know. I mean, the Indy thing is huge, but it's all hidden. Okay. It's 40,000 square feet and uses 1.4 million gallons of recycled water. Yeah. Um, so it's, it's currently tied.

[01:44:24] Um, so it doesn't, I guess what I was trying to get to was that. Yes. Indy, the, the exterior, the land impact. Is that it's a boxy cage. And I feel like sort of the argument for that is that they couldn't help it, but they could. It was, it was, it was a choice. It was a design choice. And it's been a design choice. That's been left undone for like 30 years.

[01:44:54] And I didn't actually award any points for that. Um, oh God. In this time when we are revisiting what a theme park can be. A la Epic Universe. A la, a la Fredo. A la Kazam. A la love you long time.

[01:45:18] I think that it's important that we hold the theme park creators and the theme park designers, the creatives is what I'll call them accountable. To the lazy design choices. Or lack of choices that they make. Is Waterworld a meaningful show? Is it a good IP?

[01:45:47] Is it a popular IP? I say, no, it's not. But you know what it is? It's a place. It's a place that exists. Not just in a theme park. But in all of us. In each one of us. That wants to see a man. A live man who told us so many jokes.

[01:46:19] Set on fire. And blown up. We absolutely need to play that. At the end of every show. I agree. It needs to be for every closing argument. Because it doesn't matter what you say. And you didn't say a lot. I said nothing. But it was so much more impactful. Because you did. And I'm sorry I threw a little tantrum. It's just, it's frustrating sometimes.

[01:46:49] And I'm going to be just kind of too honest here. Having some of the communication problems. That I do have. When it's like, no, I'm trying to say this. And it feels sometimes. And I'm not saying that you were doing this. I just, it does sometimes feel like. When I'm trying to say something. And it doesn't land. And then when I, what I get back is. Oh, what I heard is the actual opposite of what you just said. It's very frustrating.

[01:47:19] You definitely got triggered. Yeah. I did. You've known me long enough to know that I would never do that intentionally. Okay. I know. And I feel like I did hear you. But clearly I didn't. However, I did not go into this thinking that indie. I would think that indie is just a better show all around. It's, you know, epic, stun, spectacular. There's my bias going in. Disney versus Universal. I had taken notes. We talked about relevance.

[01:47:47] Talked about a behind the scenes show versus just a mini version of a movie. Maybe that nobody saw. More people can see indie, blah, blah, all the things. Right. At this point, the score is tied. And I'm kind of brought in my head, Dan. I was trying to figure out how to justify indie winning because I couldn't justify it anymore. Uh-huh. Can I give you my final argument? I thought you just did. Oh, no. I was just talking. Okay. Here we go.

[01:48:16] It was an impassioned plea. More than an argument. Okay. All right. Here we go. Waterworld, the stunt show shouldn't exist, but it does because it's a banger. It reinvented a cinematic failure and turned it into an event. Speaking of events, I'm going to be in Pocupsie. I don't know where that is, but you can see my tight 20-minute set I've been working on. I have some really good jokes about airplane food and how weird it is.

[01:48:46] Also, it reinvented a cinematic failure and turned it into an event. I think I already read that one. I'm not sure. The crowd energy is real. The stunts are massive. The show is alive, dangerous, funny, ever-changing. You know what else is funny? When I talk about traffic. Okay. Indiana Jones is a museum piece. You don't watch it. You visit it. One gives you a plane crash. The other gives you exposition. One is soaking wet and loving it. The other is Indiana Jones, the lack of urgency.

[01:49:17] Waterworld doesn't ask for your approval. It hits you in the face with a fireball and dares you not to love it. As a theme park goer, back to the old standby. If these two shows were sitting next to each other, which would I go see? Assuming they have the same number of shows. Yeah, that's fair. But the why there's not as many shows is still up for debate. I think there's so many possibilities.

[01:49:47] We're not equipped to speculate. We don't want to speculate. Yeah. So let's just say it's only one per day for each show. I would choose the one that's 20 minutes and kind of nonstop than over the one that is longer but has some dead spots. I'm not dead yet. What? So as much as it's difficult for me to say. So I don't get any counter.

[01:50:16] Oh, you get a closing argument. I'm sorry. Argument here. But you have to see you as the same music. It's only fair. Okay. That's it. Okay. Well, it takes a while to get going, doesn't it? That's good. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's not all that often that an elderly gentleman can rappel down onto a stage and entertain 2,000 people five times a day. You're killing me, buddy.

[01:50:47] He didn't interrupt your speech. Sorry. That's the kind of stunt show I enjoy. One where he gets to take a break and tell you what he's going to do next. You know what? In the next scene, I'm going to pretend to punch a guy and then I'll fall onto a piece of styrofoam. It'll be great. Just wait and see.

[01:51:12] You know, wasn't all that long ago that I was doing the same thing because I've been doing it for 30 years. I'm making this up. You really petered out there, Eric. Yeah, I don't know. Keep going. Okay. Now, here's the condom. That's the condom. Oh, you missed the condom part. Oh, no. I should have stayed on there. Just let it roll. You finish right before America.

[01:51:39] The trick, I got to tell you, the trick is turn the smart part of your brain off. Okay. This is the case of the supreme stunt spectacular. They both have their own merits. I personally think that Waterworld is more of a spectacle. Yeah. I can agree with that. I think the plane crash kind of tips it over. People on fire. It's a big water tank. There are more explosions.

[01:52:09] It's not people pretending to punch each other and fall off a building. It is a better stunt show. Spectacular. Even though it's not called that. It should be. I will add, and this is kind of a weird thing that I'm discovering, is that Waterworld is super entertaining and awesome. I dare say awesome in the most middle schooler kind of way. The most radical way. It's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. It's stupid, but that's what's fun about it.

[01:52:39] And it's the ironic approach to the show that makes it so good. And then on the other hand, it's almost like the only way to enjoy, fully enjoy Indiana Jones after seeing it like more than two times is to approach it with that sense of irony of like they're doing that thing again. That's hilarious. It's still happening.

[01:53:03] I think I'm landing on your point, Dan, is that Waterworld is still a popular stunt spectacular despite the fact that nobody cares about that IP. Most people don't even know what it is. I would say because. And it's still there. Whereas Indiana Jones is a popular IP, which is why it's still there. I'm not sure why people, why it's become so popular again. I love that it's so popular again because I don't want to see it go away because I love it.

[01:53:32] But I think we're now in nostalgia territory. I do. Honestly, this isn't just trying to win the argument territory. I do think it's because of Lightning Line. I think it's because. I think you're right. I think that's 100% right. It's another thing that you can reserve. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, as much as it pains me to say, Waterworld is the supreme studio park stunt show spectacular.

[01:54:00] Can't believe Universal won on a Disney podcast. And you know what? I can't even believe the guy who gets mad at us for even saying the word universal was arguing for this thing to win. I don't know. I just know good stuff. What can I say? Hey, good stuff's good stuff. Well, thank you both. Thank you, Dan and Eric for all your time and research and your efforts in making this argument for the greater good of humanity.

[01:54:26] While you do this next part, I'm going to share some of the punch up Deacon jokes like in between. So, okay. Just keep going. We have, thank you for listening. First of all, we have other shows on this network like Ears Up and Puny Pod and the Bantha Milk podcast. I'm sure they're talking about Andor. Watch the first three episodes of Andor season two. They haven't put that episode out yet, but I know they're working on it. Pretty okay.

[01:54:55] The only thing getting blown up over there is the hope of anyone under 30 understanding what they're watching. We also have Scraping the Vault. We are coming to the end of the straight-to-video Disney sequels with the Entering the Tinkerverse. Listener, send us a note if you want us to continue Scraping the Vault or if you'd like us to do a mass blowout final spectacular where we blow each other up and get each other wet.

[01:55:23] And do a Tinkerverse massive episode. That show's got the same heat as a brick wall in Galaxy's Edge at 3 p.m. and twice the crowd confusion. Are there any other shows on the network? Oh, yeah. No, no, they're not. Listen to Bowie's playing, though. Listen to The Hub Crawl. Yeah. Listen to Dan Hates the Beatles. Sure, why not? It's not a stunt show.

[01:55:52] It's a PowerPoint given by a guy whose favorite Disney resort is the Swan and Dolphin. Concierge is our sponsor, 856 Hour Ears. They will book your entire vacation for you, including your reservations, dining, etc., etc. I just booked for Carrie, who is my very first client with Concierge. I booked with her again, and she booked a hotel, Disneyland Hotel, and tickets separately because they just wanted one day.

[01:56:22] So, Concierge will not get paid the commission on that. But still doing it. Still helping her out. Because it's not a vacation package. But it's okay. She will get the same service either way, whether you do a package or just a hotel room. And I'm still going to book all of her dining for her and book her Oogie Boogie Bash tickets because that's what Concierge does. Honestly, Indy's just one man's dream with better liability insurance.

[01:56:54] That's it, everybody. Thank you for listening. Be good to each other. Until next time, court is adjourned.

[01:57:33] It's the only show in the park where the audience makes more noise during the tram ride out. Fresh baked. I was getting to a point where I'm like, Jimmy, don't pick Indy. Please don't pick Indy. Please. Yeah. At first, I was like, oh, Dan doesn't actually want this. Dwayne. He doesn't actually care.

[01:58:03] But when it comes to stunt spectacular, like a plane flying in out of nowhere and things blowing up. Indy doesn't have that many things blowing up. It's mostly stunts. So, what I was sensing was the shift from like, well, I can't give up on this. We actually have to keep trying to make an argument. For what? When I, the vibe that I got where I was just like, okay, look, if you want it to win, just fucking let it win. Yeah.

[01:58:33] I think that was that switchover moment for both of you where you were just like, well, we still have to kind of make an argument for Indy. So, let's try. I see your point. Yeah. That was it. That was 100% that switch. But it wasn't to try to make it win, but to try to make it not lose so hard. I understand that now. Yeah. I enjoyed your jokes about it being geriatric because it kind of is. Yeah. It's a Disney stunt show. It's not the same as Universal Stunt Show. I mean, that right there says it. That's good.

[01:59:03] That's it. They've been doing the same thing for 30 years. Yeah. It's like, it's like, uh, electronica or whatever that was versus mad tea party. Yeah. It's like one is an outside vendor at doing exactly what they do, which is awesome. The other is Disney going like, Hey, let's do cool. Yeah. We don't have to pay somebody. We can do it ourselves. Yeah. Awesome. Cool dudes. Yeah.