Puny Pod | Super Secret Spoiler Show - Iron Man (from the Quantum Realm)

[00:00:00] Hello Puny Podians, this is current day Ryan, or maybe slightly past Ryan, depending on when you're listening to this, what episode it's on the front of. Anyway, David and I have decided that we wanted to share with you some of our favorite content that we make, our super secret spoiler show. These episodes are typically released via the Ears Up Patreon, however, we figured we're past the Infinity Saga, we might as well grab some of those Pym Particles, run through the Quantum Realm,

[00:00:30] and release these super fun episodes from the past. A few notes before the episode starts, first, we don't have a language filter in these episodes, so cap, cover yours. Secondly, as the name implies, these have spoilers for everything up to and including any current releases at the time of recording. One last note, these were recorded about two years ago, and they undergo very, very little editing.

[00:00:59] In fact, the sound quality will kind of be what it is, and you'll kind of hear it change over time as I learn and change. Also, things we say might be a little bit out of date. You know, we don't have Doctor Strange's time stone to be able to go back in time and correct ourselves and know the future.

[00:01:23] Anyway, I hope that you guys all enjoy this nonsense, and if you want to get these less than two years from when we record them, go join the Ears Up Patreon. The link is in the show notes as always. Enjoy the episode! Thanks for visiting the TVA! Alright, y'all! Well, this is the super secret spoiler show for Iron Man with Puny Pod's own David and Ryan.

[00:01:53] That's a terrible intro. Ryan, what's going on, my man? Oh, not too much. We'll work out that intro. We will massage that intro, because that was rough. But here we are. A little insight. We are recording this three weeks after watching the original movie, but still super excited to talk about those items, those spoilers that we didn't get into in the original episode. So look forward to that.

[00:02:23] Heck yeah, dude. Heck yeah. Well, before we start, since this is a little bit more adult and we will take off the cap language filter, I wanted to ask you, sir, what are you drinking tonight? Thank you for asking. I am drinking a local beer, Pliny the Elder from Russian River Brewery.

[00:02:48] It is a delicious double IPA and a very favorite go-to drink on a cold winter night. How about you? What are you doing? What are you drinking? Nice. I, before we jump into what I'm drinking, I do want to say Pliny the Elder is like an event when it shows up around here.

[00:03:10] If it shows up in Colorado and like a restaurant has a keg, everybody flocks to that restaurant. Pliny the Elder is like a, like I say, it's an event when it shows up around here. Are you talking, are you talking the elder or the younger? The elder? The elder. I mean, the younger, they're maybe, maybe once a year, the younger will creep up somewhere in Colorado. So, um, it, that barely gets out here.

[00:03:39] I got to try it cause I used to go to great American beer festival every year down in Denver. Um, so I did get to try younger one time and, um, it's good, but yeah, elder elder is like in the beer groups I'm in on Facebook and stuff. If, if it shows up in a liquor store, everybody's posting about it and it's gone within the day. Um, well, let me know. I can ship you some.

[00:04:02] I remember, it's funny, I was just talking recently about the very first time I bought, uh, playing. And by the way, welcome to beer talk. We wouldn't be on the ears up network without some beer talk. I remember like, I remember buying, this is years ago and they had, when they first started bottling it locally. And I live in the San Francisco Bay or not too far from the Santa Rosa, um, uh, uh, facility where they brew it.

[00:04:30] And I contact the whole foods and I go down and it's a Wednesday. Like it's all sold out. I'm like, ah, fuck. Okay. All right. Go out the next day. And over the next week, I go out on Tuesday and the shelves are empty. And I'm like, what the hell? Like, just, can you just buy it all? So we, then it's like four bottles. So we don't have to put on the shelves. And it was this very secret thing. And now it's like much more prevalent, but, um, yeah, man, if you want some, let me know.

[00:05:00] Nice. Nice. Yeah. I'll have to, I'll have to try and make it out there. I, I've, I've heard like actually going to Russian rivers brewery is also pretty cool, but you can go and, um, they're known for a couple of beers, but you can go and you basically get, if you want to taste it and you get a plank that's, I don't know, it's like 12, you know, 16, one, two ounce pours, um, to get a sense for all the different ones. They make a lot of sours.

[00:05:30] They make a lot of, they've got their, like their, their, their flagship beers, but they've gotten a lot of one-off projects if you will. Yeah. Next time you're around, let me know. We'll go hit it up. Sure. For sure. For sure. Well, I, uh, hit up the beer fridge to check out what I had, uh, here in the studio. And I discovered that I had bought in like a mix six pack at some point.

[00:05:53] I picked up, um, a collaboration that brew dog brewing did with iron maiden, which since we're talking about iron man figured I should probably crack this one open. Um, it's the hell cat cold IPA. Um, and it's pretty tasty. This is the first time I've had it. Um, the cold IPA is kind of a cool style.

[00:06:17] Um, I know actually two one a, the, the sponsor of other shows on the network here is making a cold IPA now too. And it's, uh, definitely a interesting style. It's, it's an easier drinking with all the, with still all the good hops. So interesting. How do I, I've seen, um, I've had, I've just recently seen like cold IPAs and, uh, my first response was like, well, no shit.

[00:06:45] Like I want to call it, but did not realize it was a different thing. So various, you know, whether it's hazy in new England or like West coast or whatever. So, yeah. Yeah. It's, it's from my understanding, it's like a logger with extra hop, which is good. Yeah. It's all good. Cool, man. Well, let's jump into some spoilers. Um, so as a reminder for everybody, um, and for ourselves, like David said, we're, we're

[00:07:13] recording this well after having watched the movie and having recorded the first episode. So, uh, I wanted to do a little bit of reminders for us even, um, this is kind of our time to talk about what in Iron Man, like links out to the rest of the MCU. Um, so during the main show, you know, we did not spoil these things.

[00:07:39] Um, if you want to hear our breakdown of the, uh, or of the, the movie, um, and you're just listening to this cause it came through on like the ears up Patreon feed or whatever. Um, definitely go check out, check us out. Uh, puny pod is spelled P U N Y P O D. We are on all major podcast, uh, apps. I double checked actually just before we were sitting down to record this.

[00:08:06] Um, and I got us submitted to, uh, Google podcasts and I heart radio. Those were the last two. If, if you are catching us, you know, here on the ears up, um, Patreon feed and, and you haven't listened to our show yet, uh, please go check it out. Yes. The hour and 50 minute runtime is daunting. Um, but it's, it, I think it's good content and it is not a watch along.

[00:08:35] So it's not like you hit play and then start the movie or anything like that. Um, we do a, we do a breakdown of the movie in there. So, um, probably won't include that in all of these secret shows, but figured for those of you who are just catching us for the first time, some good information for you. I would point out, um, we are not in the top 10 yet.

[00:09:01] Um, but, but podcasts, the little known technical fact, they only record the top 10 podcasts in the world. So I think we can reasonably claim like 12 or 14. There you go. There you go. Yeah. Yeah. Seems, seems reasonable. Just outside, just outside. Just, just a bit outside. All right. Well, David, so I think it makes sense to go through this kind of in order of things that

[00:09:32] connect out, um, I guess kind of in order of where they showed up in the movie. Um, so one of the first things that, or one of the first people that links out, um, was actually your MVP. You picked Jensen as your MVP. Um, and I, I really liked, uh, he's, it's interesting because in this movie and, and for

[00:10:00] those of you who have not watched Iron Man in a while, go back and watch it because we could honestly do a full breakdown of just the stuff that links back out to, to elsewhere in the MCU because at this point they have bled that, they bled that movie dry. Um, they, they, everything links to somewhere else. So I don't want to spend a lot of time, you know, breaking down every single scene.

[00:10:26] Um, but Jensen, uh, during, during the time where Tony's in the cave, Jensen's like we met at a conference in burn, um, which actually links, we get to see that conference then, um, in Iron Man three, which Iron Man three perennial. I watch it every Christmas season because so help me God, it is a fucking Christmas movie. No one can tell me otherwise.

[00:10:55] Um, but it's really cool. Cause you, you get to see that kind of that comeback. You get to see that Jensen having his conversation with Tony, uh, on down in Tony's life. Yeah. Very cool. Like it's a very cool. So the obviously goes without saying that all the Iron Man movies, like the early ones foreshadowed the later ones, if you will.

[00:11:22] So I enjoy the instant scenes much more on rewatch, mostly to, mostly to, uh, to, to see how they did a really good job of, of creating this character who would eventually, um, help to shift Tony's moral center, if you will. Yeah. Right. And obviously there's a confluence of events. He gets trapped on his chest and other things. He sees how his weapons are being, you know, being misused.

[00:11:52] He used to have this naivete of round. If I, you know, create the bigger stick it, you know, people be scared of the stick and, and we have peace. And obviously that is not the case. Um, I, I didn't enjoy, I didn't, um, enjoy is not the right word. I didn't appreciate Jensen enough when I first watched him. And then when I watched him the second time, really like for me of, of the, in the rewatch

[00:12:19] jumped out of this, of the, on the, on the, on the screen as this really important character. Cause they've got a, we talked about before, Iron Man's a really important movie. You have to nail Iron Man. Yeah. Like, cause it's the first of the MCU. If it fails, if it pulls an Electra, like the MCU is screwed. Yeah. Right. Um, and they do a good job with, you know, laying out a, a, a character development story in a short period of time.

[00:12:47] And Jensen scene was like, he was great all the way through. Yeah. Yeah. I think when you're watching Iron Man for the first time, Jensen is kind of just a, a side character. Right. And, and just kind of like guy number three who, you know, just have to push Tony along. Whereas like when you rewatch it, especially with the knowledge of everything else that

[00:13:14] happens in the universe, um, he, he's so much more impactful. So, um, the other thing in the same time as we're seeing Jensen, we're seeing the 10 rings, right. Um, which 10 rings, um, to go back to Iron Man three, uh, kind of used and abused by Iron Man three and like a terrible representation of the Mandarin.

[00:13:43] Um, I, I loved Trevor in, in Iron Man three. Like I have this weird of this weird, like mixed feeling. Cause absolutely they destroyed the Mandarin idea in, in Iron Man three. Now go on down a few more movies and you get to Shang-Chi phenomenal version of it, right? Great version of, of Mandarin and 10 rings.

[00:14:09] Iron Man three, uh, you get like a fake Mandarin. Um, so, so real quick, real quick. So, so, so, um, Iron Man three, um, in the comic books, right? The 10 rings, like, uh, the Mandarin, these are our, the Mandarin is a, a serious Marvel badass who has these 10 rings that provide certain powers and Iron Man three.

[00:14:39] You have Ben Kingsley Academy award winner playing Trevor, who is basically pretending to be the Mandarin character that we'll get into once we get into Iron Man three, but it's, it's, it's, it's, it's a joke. It's a spoof. Right. Right. And so there's the element of God, they did, did the Mandarin dirty. He's just like a, he's a fucking drunk actor in the, in the movie. And I'm like, what, wait, what's happening right now?

[00:15:07] Um, in Shang-Chi, it's like, it's, it's, it's much more prevalent and they do a better job of resuscitating it. But I remember at the time I was just like, wait, what? Like, seriously? Yeah. And, and cause you, you also got like high or at least I got hype. I got hyped because they showed the, the Mandarin in the trailers. Right. And, and you're like, oh, cool.

[00:15:36] They're bringing in Ben Kingsley and they're bringing in the Mandarin. Like, like you said, bad-ass in the comics, like super key villain for Iron Man as well. Right. Like, um, kind of always was the antithesis to Iron Man's tech versus the Mandarin's mystic powers. Yep. Um, so cool. But then they, they just shit the bed with it.

[00:16:03] So, um, but I do like that they retcon that come Shang-Chi and we end up finding out in Shang-Chi that this version of the 10 rings that is operating out of Afghanistan is just one cell of the 10 rings. Right. Uh, so the, the, the, the Afghani, uh, 10 rings that kidnapped Tony in Iron Man one is

[00:16:31] just one cell of the 10 rings, which definitely, I think that was, was definitely a retcon. I don't think at the time that they made Iron Man one, they had any idea that, that 10 rings would come back and would end up being Southeast Asian again. Right. I think they co-opted it to a middle Eastern villain, uh, for the time and, and all that.

[00:16:58] Um, we talked about that in the main episode of how this was very timely of a, of a movie. And, and so I think they made it for the time and I think they had, if you'd asked anybody, probably at the time, they were like, Oh yeah, we just moved the 10 rings into, into Afghanistan. They, they weren't thinking of it as a cell of, you know, this master plan that we ended up finding out in.

[00:17:24] You raise really a point, which, which I think we, we need to kind of keep in mind as we start with episode one of the MCU. There's no, there's no big tapestry. Like we don't know how the stuff is, is, is linked together. Like they have some things which they do a very good job in later movies, like stitching together and bringing, you know, tying in little things that you see in different movies, little kernels, little crumbs, the Captain America shield and all that kind of stuff.

[00:17:54] But they had no idea that it would work out as well as it did. And so, yeah, there's an element where we're throwing this out there. We, we don't anticipate this is going to come back in Iron Man. There may not even be an Iron Man three. This movie bombs. There's no MCU. We're done. Like you're licensing it out and, you know, enjoy, um, you know, daredevil made by new line cinema or whomever, right?

[00:18:21] Like enjoy multiple Spider-Man remakes by Sony. Yeah. So, um, so yeah, I thought that was so that the 10 rings was, um, was a nice little like kernel. Um, but what did you think? Like the, the biggest, the character who has the most prominent presence in the MCU other

[00:18:48] than Robert Downey Jr. and Pepper and Rhodey agent, Philip Colson shows up in a completely oversized suit, which I cannot get past. Like, yeah. Hey man, Indochino is $400. Jesus Christ. Just go and get something in your size. But anyway, like, so what are your, um, when you think of Philip Colson, like he's a huge character. He is. Right. He really is.

[00:19:17] He's, he, like, like you said, there's, there's no way they knew it at the time. They didn't know what Phil Colson was going to be. The most that they knew about the MCU, the biggest, I guess, gamble they took was that after credit scene, right? The, the, the idea of the Avengers initiative being introduced by, um, Samuel L. Jackson playing, um, Nick Fury, but Phil Colson.

[00:19:46] I, I kind of think, you know, if I had to guess, I would guess Clark Gregg kind of just stole the show in some ways. And, and I feel like this movie probably, and his performance in this movie and the way he showed up, got him into the rest of the MCU and got him the part he has in the MCU. If, if I had to guess, like they probably would have had a dozen different, uh, shield agents

[00:20:15] just kind of popping in and out of the movies, you know, shield in the comics is, is kind of, it's a government agency. So, you know, there's a million different people who work for it and there's shield agents of plenty. Um, and so I think, you know, if, if maybe Phil Colson hadn't shown up the way he did, um, or Clark, Clark Gregg, you know, didn't give Phil Colson the life he did. You know, I, I, I kind of suspect that the story probably would have moved forward with

[00:20:44] just random shield agent number three meeting Thor and, you know, um, so on and so forth throughout the series. So it was, it is cool though, that, that like Colson got to be the, the center point. Um, ultimately he got his show, right. Um, which we, I should mention here, uh, we will not be reviewing the shows prior to the Disney plus shows.

[00:21:12] Um, which by the way, those are like three years out for us to get to the Disney plus shows. So don't hold us to that right now, but the plan as of today is to review those Disney plus shows. Um, a lot can change in three years. Um, but, um, but yeah, the, you know, he got Colson got his show in agents of shield, um, which I watched some of it, you know, he's definitely enjoyable.

[00:21:41] Um, and so I think, I think he, yeah, I think he probably kind of carved out his space through this movie. If I had to guess. It's a fair comment. Um, the, his character, he, like he's a, when you start talking about threads through the MCU, like Phil Coulson, we, you know, we'll, we'll talk about him at greater length as we get to later movies.

[00:22:09] Um, but the introduction to shield, the importance of it, the, the, the, you know, the flow through Nick Fury, the later stuff we get into when we start talking about shield has been compromised, but Hydra, all that stuff is really, um, really well done. And I will say that, um, they did a really good job of just of planting this one kernel. Yeah. We don't see Jeff Bridges again. I love Jeff Bridges.

[00:22:39] He's fantastic in the movie. Like his overacting is awesome. And I'm going to come back to that in a second, but, um, they, the Philip Coulson character is really kind of, I think sort of instrumental because it, it, it binds together a bunch of different movies and take things out of this kind of weird superhero, like, you know, face Spanish space fantasy realm into like, Oh, this is actually stuff that's happening in

[00:23:08] the real world. And as we talked about before, a lot of Marvel comics, especially with the characters written in the sixties, there was, there were elements of like responding to what was going on in the culture. There was like the anti-war movement. There was like some anti-government sentiment depending upon. And so to see it develop, you talk about the, the, the Avengers, the weaponizations, Cody, like the Scovia cords. It's really, uh, it's really well done. Yeah.

[00:23:38] Yeah, definitely. Um, definitely one of those things. And I think, um, I think they, like you said, they, they couldn't have known how this movie was going to be used, but they've done a masterful job of going back and using every piece of this movie. Um, some minor ones that we don't have to spend too much time on, but, um, like the cheeseburgers, right? Mm-hmm.

[00:24:09] Uh, Tony comes back to the U S he wants cheeseburgers. Man, that, that like tears me up when I watch it. Um, now because of when we, when we see, uh, on down the line in end game, it, you know, there, there's the beautiful scene where Tony has died.

[00:24:34] He's, he's made the sacrifice play and his daughter Morgan is sitting there talking with happy and she just wants a cheeseburger. And man, now you go back and it's a throwaway line, right? It's meant to kind of show that, that Tony's just kind of a, a joker or, you know, kind of a comedic relief piece of him wanting a cheeseburger. Um, kind of became super meaningful because they reused it.

[00:25:02] Um, same thing with like the Tony has a heart, uh, thing. Um, you know, same scene actually in end game that ends up being his Viking funeral. They, they float out his, the, the Tony, the proof Tony Stark has a heart. Yep. Um, and with the way the MCU goes, somebody, some evil, somebody is going to go pick up that arc reactor from the middle of that Lake in Atlanta.

[00:25:26] And it's going to end up being, uh, reused in some, maybe, maybe a iron monger will come back. He'll get that, that arc reactor and put it back in his suit. Um, so spoiler, uh, uh, Tony Stark is dead in the last adventure movie, but to your point, the other one that, that I got on rewatch was the, um, I'm iron man quote. Yeah.

[00:25:54] Which he says at the press conference and he says that the snap when he's got, he's snapping Thanos back. Like, ah, so good. They did a, oh man, I can't, cannot wait to get to that point. Yeah. I apologize in advance. That is going to be a two hour episode and you all just have to deal with it. It is so good. It's so good. Maybe we'll break our release pattern and we'll release two, two episodes that month.

[00:26:21] Uh, maybe like I do, I, man, I've again, not to get too far ahead, but I remember like watching infinity born leaving the theater. I was like stressed. I was like, I gotta wait like months for this. Oh man. Yeah. So good. Um, one other, um, so we talked about Colson. We talked a little bit. I want to go back to, um, to Jeff Bridges.

[00:26:49] We didn't talk about it in the main show, but one of the things I found out, uh, when doing a little bit of research was that. But so, so Marvel who has no experience making movies, they mostly licensed their stuff out and they would make money off of the, the movies that Sony and new line and, you know, 20th century Fox nuts would make.

[00:27:13] So the script evidently was not completely finished when filming began. And so, um, the dialogue was often ad libbed. This will be an issue in Iron Man two, which we'll talk about. And it becomes a big issue. And that's one of the reasons why Iron Man two is perhaps perceived as kind of like disjointed.

[00:27:36] So, um, like John Favreau who directed it acknowledges that he felt like this made the, the, the film seem more natural. So some things were shot with two cameras to capture improvised lines. Robert Downey Jr. Who's like, who seems to me like if you were a comedian, very sharp, like easy to send that. But, um, but like Gwyneth Paltrow and Jeff Bridges, you know, both expressed that.

[00:28:05] Like, um, like Gwyneth Paltrow said she had difficulty matching Downey and Jeff Bridges said he felt his quote, his comment was like, he felt really uncomfortable not having a script of rehearsals since he's normally very prepared and knows his line word for word. And then finally realizing quote, we were making a $200 million student film and he took the pressure off. He was like, eh, fuck it.

[00:28:34] The wheels are off. Don't care. And that made the, the, for me made the movie seem, uh, light and joyful. Like I, I appreciate the fun kind of ad libby kind of stuff. I like, I like smirking, smirking Robert Downey Jr. I like him, this very affable comedic. He is very funny.

[00:29:02] Um, Iron Man 2, it did not hold up, but in this movie played out well. Yeah. Yeah. And I think, I think this point has been beat to death by other podcasters, other reviews. That is what made the MCU successful is very, at least the early movies.

[00:29:27] And we'll talk about this, I think a little bit because spoiler alert for those who are listening to this between the time that we recorded the Iron Man episode and the today where we're recording, um, this after hours, both of us have watched the incredible Hulk. So, um, we, you know, obviously we have some opinions there and I don't want to take too

[00:29:50] much away from our main show when we get there, but with the exception of the incredible Hulk, I think the first phase of, of the MCU is very light. It is very fun. And, and that is what made Marvel successful versus DC, right?

[00:30:12] DC always wanted to be this brooding, dark comic book movie that, that like, it's just so hard to get casual fans into that. You'd like getting, getting somebody who's never read a comic book before in, into a, a dark brooding movie, like comic book movie is so, so hard. Um, and that's why I think some of the best Batman, I mean.

[00:30:42] Don't get me wrong. Dark brooding, dark night trilogy is phenomenal, but looking at on the other side of the aisle, if you will, at the MC or at the DC movies, those early Tim Burton movies were some of the best movies that DC has put out. And those were fun. They were silly. They, they, they played into the campiness that comics carry.

[00:31:07] Yeah, we could, we could, and maybe we say if we have a separate, um, after our show to talk about the DCEU. I agree that the, um, the kind of campy, the kind of like Arnold Schwarzenegger and Dan DeVito is villains, like remind you a little bit of the, uh, Batman TV show, which was extremely like campy and humorous.

[00:31:33] I think the DC got, um, I think the, like the dark night is a, a fantastic film. It is an, a, a great, uh, superhero movie. It's a great movie. It's fantastic, right? Fantastic performances.

[00:31:59] But I think the DC has taken the approach of like, oh, let's just make everything super dark. Yeah. And I think they're also penalized because unlike Marvel, the DC, we talked about this before the DC characters followed a certain archetype. And so everything, like the characters are all perfect. Like you couldn't, there was no, like you couldn't pick up on Wonder Woman flaws or the

[00:32:24] flash or what have your Superman and everything had to have this gravitas that didn't necessarily have to happen in the MCU. Yeah. And we could have a big, what if around like, what if, you know, Kevin Feige took over the DCEU as opposed to the MCU, which I'm glad you did not.

[00:32:46] Cause I prefer Marvel, um, the Marvel properties, but you can, you, you can see where in 2008, when the dark night comes out, like that shifted everything. Yeah. Yeah. And everything is grainy and dark and like, ah, it's great for Batman, but it's not great for the other stuff. Right. And I, and I think like similarly over on our side of the aisle here in the, the Marvel

[00:33:15] world, Marvel knew, knew to like introduce some of those heavier concepts, like get down to the Eternals, right? The Eternals, Black Widow. Um, those, those are more serious movies. Those have much more gravitas, much, much more realism to them.

[00:33:40] Um, and, but they knew to not introduce that to like several phases in. Right. Um, you, you kind of, you kind of have to bait people in with the, with the candy, with the brain candy. Right. And, and not to say Iron Man is pointless. Like it's a, it's a very good movie. Obviously we talked all about that in the main show. I love it. Um, but, um, it's definitely easygoing.

[00:34:09] It's, it doesn't take a lot of digestion. Um, whereas like getting into, especially now where we sit today in the multiverse saga, talk about taking some digestion, right? Um, a different type of digestion. It's not dark or anything per se, but it's, it takes a lot of understanding. And so you kind of have to prime your viewers. You, you have to get people into it.

[00:34:36] And I think that's something that the MCU does so well is it, is it has figured out how to prime the, the wide audience to what it's doing. And it knows how to Kevin five, Kevin Feige or Kevin, the supercomputer, if you, uh, watch she Hulk, um, knows how to kind of drive everybody to the point where you need to get

[00:35:02] to so that you can do multiverse of madness, um, kind of stuff, or, you know, the trailer that just came out this week as of recording, um, quantum mania, which is going to be weird. It's going to be wild. Uh, and if that had been your first release, I don't think the MCU would be where it is today. If yeah. Yeah.

[00:35:27] So, so, uh, as was suggested in a, uh, message that if we did a rewatch of the MCU a to Z Ant-Man, Ant-Man two Ant-Man quantum mania, like it would be bizarre. Right. Um, yeah, I mean, we'll talk when we get closer to, we'll talk about, we will get into all the quantum mania.

[00:35:53] Like I, I, so as a comic book reader back in the seventies and eighties, like didn't get into like all the different realms and the six one six and all the different realities and the branch chain, all that kind of stuff. And I'd like to think of myself as fairly comic nerdy.

[00:36:18] And while, um, I will appreciate the education and the, the, the illustration and the, the, what they're going to do, there's a whole group that'll be like, oh, wait, uh, that dude's dead. He wants to see that again. Like what, wait, why is, wait, why is Thor now this character? Why is, why have the thing, why have these things changed?

[00:36:47] And I don't have, but I'm, I'm here for it. I'm, I am, I am down for, I, uh, what, uh, Kevin Feige will, will lay out. Like he has done a fantastic job. I implicitly trust whatever he's doing, but it'll be interesting to see how it plays out. Because I think it'll, it will pay off, but it, you, you have to kind of build all that stuff up.

[00:37:13] And I realized that like a lot of what they didn't in, um, phase four was doing that very thing. Right. Yeah. I think you're headed towards a point where the MCU, the MCU is at an interesting point because it's simultaneously super successful while also almost suffering from its own success because.

[00:37:39] And somebody who's new, like, I couldn't imagine a 13 year old kid trying to get into the MCU today. Right. 30 movies that your parents didn't let you watch. And now like, okay, I want to watch quantum mania. That's the new one coming out. Oh, I have 30 movies to catch up on, to understand how we got here. Oh, wow.

[00:38:04] And obviously that's why our podcast exists so that people, people can get, get caught up, but, but, um, but no, like I think I do think like modern day where we are with the MCU, it is, it is going to be tricky and it'll be interesting to see how it all plays out for sure. I think they do.

[00:38:26] Um, I think Marvel does a pretty good job of, and it's, this is a, a, a tough, uh, tight rope to walk, which is puts out a movie that on its own is enjoyable. Which also includes kernels, which also include for future things and past things, which also includes something for all the comic fans. Yeah. Right. And which lays groundwork for future things. Right.

[00:38:56] So I could just go see ant-man by itself. It's fun. It's a heist film. Right. Right. I can enjoy it. But I also know that ant-man appears in like, you know, Captain America, Civil War and like all this other stuff that happens down the line. You start getting into like time travel and, and build towards other things, if you will. And so I, they do a really good job of that.

[00:39:21] And I, and, and so for that reason, I'm, I'm looking forward to the, the, um, the next phase, but it's sort of like, I describe it as, okay, I've got a magician. He or she's going to do a magic act. I know what the trick's going to be. How do they pull it off? Yeah. Right. Like, I trust they will do it because it's, you know, but there's the element of like, how are they going to do it? And then you watch, you're like, oh, wow. That's how they did it.

[00:39:50] That's fantastic. So, um, so for, for, for purposes of like Iron Man, like we, we talked a little bit about, like we've talked in the main show about the, the background, the scenes. Um, I'm going to, uh, diverge for just a moment. Like you have had, and in probably present, like a world ranked facial hair beard. Yes.

[00:40:21] In this movie, we see some, and this is going to be a theme that we're going to touch on in a few movies. We see some wild facial hair, principally Robert Down Jr. Tony Stark, weird, kind of like zigzag, uh, uh, um, facial hair and Obadiah Stain. And I want your thoughts on the respective facial. We're, we'll start with Obadiah.

[00:40:51] Full plumage, nice beard. Might be taped on. Don't know. What do you think? Uh, yeah. So Obadiah has in, in the bearding world. So a little bit of background for everybody. Um, I once upon a time did competitive bearding. Uh, I competed in the world beard and mustache championships in Austin, Texas.

[00:41:20] Um, uh, and I did, uh, so my category is full beard with a styled mustache. Um, at the time I had a 12 inch or longer beard. So I was in that sub category. Um, so. So Obadiah has what in the bearding world we would call a business beard, um, or a beard under, uh, four inches off the, the chin. Um, honestly, it looks great. It looks very full.

[00:41:50] I, I don't, I couldn't tell if it was taped on. Um, if, if any of my old bearding friends are listening, uh, ask your whiskey, ask your local whiskerina to check and see if that's, that looks like a fake beard. They would be the ones to know. Um, but, um, yeah, yeah. I think it was a good beard and it fit his face. Well, I, I think, uh, Obadiah rocked that beard for sure.

[00:42:18] So as a side note, like I realized this is not going to be an emerging segment, but okay. Um, cause I had no idea about the classifications. It looks good. Like I thought he looked, um, it's great. It looks clean. It looks tight. I didn't realize the classifications. Uh, I, I, I struggle on rewatch with the Robert Downey Jr. One.

[00:42:43] Cause I realized in the comic book, he's got a specific, like he's got some cool zigzag kind of facial hair, but I remember first watching it and I'm just distracted. So I need, I need your thoughts on, uh, Robert Downey Jr.'s facial hair. Yeah. In this one, it looks rough. And I, I actually had in my notes and we didn't bring this up in the main show. He keeps it incredibly well kept in that, that cave.

[00:43:11] Uh, so whatever they're doing, right. Um, and that actually has, I, I can't remember. I'm, I, I was over here trying to Google it to find it. There's actually a category of beards, um, that is so in the bearding world, there's freestyle, which freestyle is crazy. I was on a billboard once upon a time with a freestyle beard. Um, yeah, I'm, I'm leaving little kernels for, for future weirdness.

[00:43:39] Um, but, um, like there is a, there's a category of bearding where you shave designs into your beard. Um, and I can't remember what it's called. Uh, it's got a German name, but anyways, um, that, that's what Tony's beard always reminds me of is like, it's like that razor cut in and it does not look good in this movie at the end of the day.

[00:44:04] It's, it's not like, even as somebody who is her sweet as I am, uh, it is not distracting necessarily for me, but it's definitely weird. Uh, to your point, it is, um, consistent throughout the film, which I appreciate. So it does, it's not like some weird zigzag is there and then it's gone. And all of a sudden it's weird.

[00:44:31] Um, I do, I'm not gonna lie. I am so excited for this category going forward. Like this is a, uh, I am so excited. I am thinking ahead to future films. Yeah. This would be great. Yeah. This should be great. This should be super fun. And yeah. Um, maybe, maybe I can get some of my old bearding guys. Maybe we can get some guests out of the bearding guys. We'll see some of them. Yeah.

[00:44:59] Like let's, we could have our, our bearded rankings. Like so, so far it's Obadiah number one, uh, time to start number two. Good to know. Cause we're going to get into it, uh, in the next few movies. Uh, Thor, um, beard. Yeah. I don't think Thor has a full beard in Thor. Oh yeah. You're right. Because that not to spoil too much for, for a future episode.

[00:45:28] I'm sure I'm going to make sure this comes back up to tell the force full story. Um, but I had a roommate at the time that Thor came out who hated the movie or Thor two. He hated the movie because in the comic books, there's a storyline where Thor gets his beard when he becomes King Thor. Uh, and in Thor two, Thor had a beard and he lost his ever living shit about it.

[00:45:55] So, um, yeah. Um, yeah. Sorry. Sorry. No, it's, it's funny. And it, it's comic book people, man. I, yes, we are comic book people. Uh, but man, the, the things, the things that people find to like talk about sometimes just crack me up.

[00:46:20] So, uh, yeah, we will, um, we will operate as buffers between. So, so the thought is like, we will instill and share like a comic book background. Um, uh, you know, trivia, detail stuff on the movie, but it is our promise to you that we will shield you from that level of comic book obsession. Yeah.

[00:46:51] I have never heard the beard thing before. That's wild. Yeah, I have. Uh, it, yeah. Um, yeah. So, yeah. Uh, to get back to Iron Man though, to route us back the, I guess the one other like tie into the rest of the universe that I wanted to talk a little bit about, um, was Rhodey. So Rhodey, uh, sees the suit, which will eventually be his.

[00:47:17] And actually I liked that ultimately they used the same, um, they use the same, uh, suit like that. The silver Mark two, uh, ends up being Rhodey suit. That's that ends up being the first, um, iron Patriot or iron, uh, war machine. Jeez Louise. War machine. Yep. Yep. Ends up being the first war machine.

[00:47:45] Um, and so we see Terrence Howard who suspended, who suspiciously doesn't look like Rhodey looks next time. Uh, uh, say next time baby, which is so cool. And I, I'm glad they brought back the same exact suit. They figured that, you know, they, they gave that honor.

[00:48:01] Um, I think we talked about this in the main show, but man, I'm so glad they got rid of the Terrence Howard through a bitch fit about his, his pay, uh, to the point where he was no longer welcome on that set. So there were, there were, um, so we talked a little bit about it, but there were two things, there were two things. One. So he signed my reading was, he was one of the first actors to sign.

[00:48:29] He had the biggest salary in the movie, despite having the fourth largest role at best. Yeah. Right. Um, the next movie comes out, uh, he is offered a smaller role in a smaller salary. He pitches a fit.

[00:48:48] Um, there's also reports on the set that Favreau had difficulties with him, with his, his, um, his, uh, scenes and his interpretation of the character. We talked about before that the, the, the, the, there was no real chemistry between him and Robert Dan Jr. just seemed all very kind of stilted and forced. They didn't really seem like friends.

[00:49:18] Like I don't, you don't sense that kind of like that chemistry between the two and yeah. Placed him. Like we, we will, we will not get into this episode. I promise on the next one, we'll get into either the main show or the after show. When we talk about the casting, um, uh, they, the, they figured out the formula pretty quick.

[00:49:46] And for folks that didn't fit into the formula, Terrence Howard, um, you know, other actors in the MCU, like Edward Norton quickly figured it out. Yeah. And solved it for the future, if you will. So. Yeah, for sure. For sure. Um, and then I guess, yeah, I said, that was the last thing I, we talked about it already a little bit.

[00:50:15] Obviously we saw the Avengers initiative get introduced, which so cool. I mean, I, I don't know that there's much to say about that so much as it was just, it was really cool to see it introduced. I thought, um, one of the things that I really liked them dropping little kernels. Here's Iron Man. Here's the shield for Captain America. Here's Thor. Here's Hulk. Right.

[00:50:42] Um, when you look at future phases, I'm very excited personally for X-Men when it comes out. Yeah. And so whether they will drop, I mean, they've already dropped certain kernels in terms of like, um, enhanced individuals. You talk about the Eternals fighting deviants. You've got Ms. Marvel who's. A mutant apparently. I think she's mutant. I think she's officially a mutant.

[00:51:05] And so it'll be interesting to see if they do it the same way, but they like, they, I, again, kudos to the, um, producers and, and, and creative minds behind the MCU to like have a scene for like, this is the chapter of this book. We will tell hopefully the books are successful and we could tell we can write future books, but they did a great job. Fantastic job. Fantastic job. And love that little foreshadowing.

[00:51:31] As you said, like, once I saw that, I was like, oh shit, they're going to make an Avenged movie. This is going to be fucking great. Yeah. I can't like, can I fast forward my, my life to get to the Avenged movie? Cause I'm 300% in for it. Absolutely. Absolutely. Um, cool, man. Well, I know you had an idea. We were talking just before we started. You had an idea for a, what if?

[00:52:01] So I do. So, uh, what if was a famous comic book series that would take a character or scenario and change it up? So what if Captain America, like, and there's a whole TV series, which talks about it. Um, in my mind, like what, my big, what if is like, what if Tony, what if Robert Downey Jr. is not cast as Tony Stark?

[00:52:26] What if it's Tom Cruise, Nicolas Cage, any of the other people we've thought about that have been mentioned? Um, like, do we end up at the same spot? I, and I think that like, I, to answer my own question, like, I think that Tom Cruise is enough of a, uh, presence to pull it off. But like, Timothy Olyphant, like there were a bunch of names. So like, what would have happened?

[00:52:56] Like, cause I feel like Robert Downey Jr.'s like personal history persona lends itself perfectly for Tony Stark. Flawed person on display, public nose. It was like, and I, I can't, I honestly can't imagine anyone else in the role, but like, like, what if, what if someone else did it? What, like, what are your thoughts? Yeah. Yeah. I think, um, I think it'd be interesting.

[00:53:26] I, I know. So for multiverse of madness, there was like rumors that we were going to get our Robert or our, uh, Tom Cruise Ironman, um, kind of disappointed. We didn't, that would have been cool to see.

[00:53:41] Um, but like, I think, I think Tom Cruise would have fit, uh, especially, I, I want to say by 2008, he had gone through some of the Scientology, the spaz on Oprah's couch kind of stuff. So I think fitting, I think Tom Cruise could have fit Timothy Olyphant, maybe less, less so because he's. He's, he's less that character. Right.

[00:54:11] And I think going to, to Marvel's casting top to bottom, a lot of these actors are like embody the characters, um, whether it's. Whether it's Robert Downey Jr. As Iron Man or it's, um, like, uh, I cannot pronounce her name, but the, the young woman who played, um, Ms. Marvel.

[00:54:38] Um, she, she is a huge Marvel fan who, who just goes in and like was at comic cons and stuff, which is perfect for that character. Um, to some degree, um, uh, Mark Ruffalo, which we'll talk about in our next main episode, the, the other Hulk.

[00:55:00] Uh, but Mark Ruffalo, you know, you can see him being very Bruce Banner like, and so I think that's something that like. That's, that's where like the idea of a Timothy Olyphant maybe works, but he isn't that character in life. He's not Robert Downey Jr. He's not Robert Downey Jr. He's not like Tom Cruise fits Tony Stark because he, he has gone through some of those struggles and it would have, I think, fit to some degree.

[00:55:31] Yeah. Um, eccentric, right? Like, yeah, there's magic. Like, you know, there's a little ego thing there for sure. And in my head, now I'm talking myself into the wildest one that you posited, which is Nick Cage. Nick Cage is Iron Man, which would be a absolutely a different movie. Uh, 150% a different movie, but also.

[00:55:59] Like, he's a Coppola child, like has lived a pretty public life. Maybe he wouldn't be as bad as, as my initial reaction was. So I think, um, the other one that was considered for it was, uh, Hugh Jackman and would have been interesting had he gotten it. Like the impact on Fox's, you know, X-Men run. Yeah.

[00:56:29] Um, Nicholas Cage. Like, if you want to pull like a, you know, Al Pacino overacting moment, like maybe Loki, you know what I mean? Like, but I can't see like Robert Downey Jr. Like they need to bring him back. Morbius. So he can be a vampire. Yeah.

[00:56:59] Like maybe. Okay. All right. So running bit, uh, we have to workshop this bit. Uh, Nicholas Cage. What role is he in this movie? And maybe that's just the running theme of like, cause he is such a superhero fan. He auditioned for Superman, Iron Man. He got Hellraiser. Like, I think he minded. I can't remember if he did Batman as well, but like he loves superhero films. So maybe let's for every episode.

[00:57:28] We're like, Oh, what's his role? Um, not in this one, not Iron Man. Uh, maybe, but maybe Obadiah Stane, right? Yeah. Overacting, hamming it up. Right. Yeah. I think, uh, I think Obadiah Stane was already overacted. So I think, I think the brain goes there quickly. Um, but I think it goes there well.

[00:57:55] Um, oh, maybe, maybe, maybe he turns it way down and he's the ensign. Oh man. That would be hilarious. All right. We should stop now. Yeah. Yeah. Diverging. So, especially because I think, uh, the more, yeah, yeah. Uh, that's not a path I want to tread. I don't think. Um, but yeah.

[00:58:24] Um, any, any, I guess I feel like, I feel like that's most of our content here for this, this after show. So anything else you got? No, I feel wrapped up. Like I am, uh, I'm looking forward to the Hulk, the incredible Hulk. Sorry. Uh, and I, I, for future episodes of the super secret show, uh, to like, to go back and, and

[00:58:53] to see where we are and see how everything builds on the future things. So that's, I'm looking forward to. Cool. Well, as, as is tradition with, uh, puny pod, it is not puny. Um, our original, just a little bit of behind the scenes. Our original plan was 30 minutes, uh, at recording. We're at an hour. We're crossing the hour mark. As I speak, um, editing. You'll probably hear this at less than an hour, but that's all right. Um, but yeah.

[00:59:19] So if you're catching us again, like I said earlier, if you're catching us for the first time on the, uh, ears up Patreon, if, if you're just, you know, if you have your RSS feed set to the ears of Patreon and you're used to hearing the secret show and now you also get to hear, uh, the Supreme resort after dark. Um, check us out. Puny pod. We're on all the major pod catchers.

[00:59:48] Um, I should have probably said this earlier. Maybe I'll edit that. I'll go back and edit in a little explanation of the show. Um, but we do rewatch the MCU in release order. Uh, so check out Iron Man. I would also check out our legends episode. Um, we, we did a lot of research into that. Like David did a hell of a lot of research and it was awesome. Um, and so, um, don't, you know, I know a lot of podcasts do those intro episodes and

[01:00:17] you kind of just skip it cause you know, who gives a shit. Um, but really that, that intro episode is, is really interesting and definitely something to check out. Um, and then our next episode is on the incredible Hulk. Um, make sure you watch, if you are watching along with us, make sure you watch the incredible Hulk, not only is, uh, Hulk with Eric Banna as Bruce Banner, not, uh, the seventies TV show

[01:00:46] with, uh, with Lou Ferrigno as the Hulk. Uh, we are watching the incredible Hulk with Ed Norton. If you're having trouble finding it is on HBO max. Uh, it is, I think one of the few departures we're going to have to take from Disney plus to be able to watch this. So check it out. Um, and follow along with us. That episode should be coming out.

[01:01:09] Um, the, I am target, we are targeting release the seventh of, uh, February. So that's the first Tuesday of the month that is, uh, incidentally when we released Iron Man. So we'll try and target the same, uh, the first Tuesday of each month. So we'll see how we get, uh, how we go there, but, um, that's our target. So other than that, uh, David, anything else you got to add?

[01:01:39] No, I'm good. I appreciate the super fun nerding out as always. Absolutely. Absolutely. Well, I appreciate your time, man. And, um, yeah, I hope everybody enjoyed the super secret spoiler show and, uh, we will see you on the next one. Take it easy. All.